96 Sleepy Hollow

0:23LeeGood evening and welcome to Horror. I'm Lee.

0:26ChrisI'm Chris.

0:27AdamAnd I'm Adam.

0:28LeeAnd we are here this evening in the run-up to Halloween to discuss the uh, yeah, I don't want to give, you know, play my cards too soon or whatever, but the absolute genius piece of work in my honest opinion that is Tim Burton's Sleepy Hollow.

0:45LeeUm, but ahead of that,

0:47LeeChris.

0:49LeeI know you've been busy with uh other homework in preparation for Halloween.

0:54ChrisWe've had a busy, busy one this weekend, yeah.

0:57LeeWe may have something planned for Halloween as a little bit of a secret treat, but uh you'll just have to hold on and see. Um,

1:05Leebut apart from that, have you managed to see anything, Chris?

1:08ChrisI haven't.

1:08ChrisSo I'm just going to say, Trick 'r Treat is awesome, go and watch that.

1:14ChrisAnd Donnie Darko, and Beetlejuice, and that's it.

1:20LeeCool.

1:21AdamAnd nice bit, nice bit of Burton prep there as well.

1:24ChrisIt is, yeah.

1:25ChrisBecause I didn't, I didn't realize Sleepy Hollow was, I'm sure you said that several times lead up to it.

1:31AdamWell, if I recall rightly, Lee's exact words at the end of the last episode were, we're going to examine Tim Burton Sleepy Hollow.

1:40ChrisSee, I, I cut, I cut out those sort of phrases. It's, it's filtered before it enters my consciousness.

1:47LeeTape in a hopes.

1:50LeeUm, Adam,

1:50Leehave you watched anything?

1:53AdamWhat?

1:54AdamWell, I've watched a couple of bits. Um, you can, I've on YouTube uh, Apaches is on YouTube in full, which is like a half-hour um, uh, government information film, you know, warning of dangers, etcetera. from the '70s.

2:04AdamAnd uh, it's basically, kids, don't play on farms.

2:08AdamIn which, basically, they take six kids to a farm and murder one, murder them one by one.

2:15LeeOh.

2:16AdamNo, seriously.

2:17AdamSeriously, it's

2:19ChrisWhat, why do they get murdered?

2:21AdamUh, one gets, uh, his head caved in by a tractor wheel.

2:25LeeY-yes.

2:25AdamUh, a little, a little girl drinks like rat poison.

2:28AdamAnd dies at home screaming.

2:32ChrisHmm.

2:32AdamUm, there's, uh, what else?

2:35AdamSomeone gets a big heavy gate fall on them.

2:38AdamUh, someone drowns.

2:40AdamOh, someone drowns in liquid shit.

2:43ChrisHmm.

2:44AdamSomeone drowns in the cesspit.

2:46LeeOh.

2:47AdamIt's like and yeah, it's, I mean, it's it's worth watching, but fuck me is it harsh?

2:50AdamBecause after each, after each kid dies,

2:55Adamthere's like a little vignette of like, it's the only peg that's not got a coat on it at school.

3:01AdamAnd then they, and then they just take the kid's name off the tuck, like the sticky label above it that's like got the kid's name on it. Or they clear out their school desk.

3:12AdamAnd it's just, yeah.

3:14ChrisThey don't hit him.

3:15AdamYeah, but this is the thing, I think it comes from a very good time of where there was no fanny in about, and there was no, please like us because, you know, you voted us in, so please like us. So, do, do what you want.

3:31AdamI want to see a 1978 COVID advert.

3:39LeeHmm.

3:39AdamWhereas like, where you just see someone walking down the street, no mask and then the voice over goes, look at this prick.

3:46LeeHe's going to be dead within three days.

3:49AdamHe's going to be dead within three days, so is every other person.

3:52ChrisWould they actually show him dying, you know?

3:54ChrisThat the uh, the it gets really bad, then he gets a bit better, then he gets bad again, then he gets a bit better.

4:00AdamOn his death bed.

4:01ChrisYeah.

4:01AdamAnd then, then Jimmy Savile comes in and says, oh, you won't be doing that again, will you?

4:09AdamAnd then he dies.

4:11AdamUh, and, and yeah, it'll be then, think, think safe. Think mask. Wear a mask, you cunt.

4:18AdamThat's the, that is literally the level that this film sort of operates at, as in kids don't go to farms.

4:26AdamAnd it's like, don't go to farms. I'm never leaving the house again.

4:31AdamBut also, it's just, it's lovely because

4:34Adamit happens over a series of days.

4:38AdamSo it's not just like this bunch of kids get wiped out in one go.

4:42AdamThey keep going back to the farm.

4:45AdamThe farmer doesn't care that they're wandering around his pissing working farm.

4:51AdamAnd yeah, one by one all the kids are getting injured.

4:53AdamAnd it's like, after the third one, come on.

4:56AdamThere should be some tape around that farm, you know, and questions are going to be asked.

5:02ChrisDo you, do you think it actually worked?

5:04LeeYeah.

5:05AdamI think it, I genuinely think it did. Although I've, I've said it before, I think I've said it before on the show, with what me and Claire have watched a lot of

5:12Adamlike government information films and stuff.

5:15AdamAnd I think one of the psychologically best one I've seen is there's a drink driving advert, which basically, for want of a better way, this is how it talks to the viewer.

5:30AdamLook, me and you, we're all right having a drink and having a drive, that's fine, isn't it?

5:34AdamBut if some bell end ploughs into you, you're going to be bang to rights because you were over the limit.

5:39AdamSo to avoid because of that prick, don't drink and drive.

5:41LeeYeah.

5:42AdamAnd it's but I think that that's the best psychology.

5:45AdamIf someone's drinking and driving, they're already over a

5:49ChrisThey're gonna be defensive about it.

5:50AdamYeah.

5:51AdamThey're already on a sort of like fuck off of what I want sort of why.

5:55AdamBut it's just such a wonderfully planned one where it's like, look at this poor innocent drink driver.

6:00AdamSomeone crashed into him and he got all the blame.

6:04AdamAnd yeah, I think that's a great.

6:06ChrisProbably did work.

6:07AdamBut all of, and like I say, all of these adverts, they're never, it's never sort of like, oh, this could happen.

6:12AdamIt's literally, don't do that, someone will die.

6:17AdamDon't put a mat on the floor, on a polished wooden floor, someone's going to break their bloody neck.

6:23LeeThe one I always remember is the kids walking along with fishing rods.

6:27LeeAnd it, and instead of having them taken apart, they're carrying them in one piece.

6:33LeeAnd one of the kids touches an electrical wire with it.

6:36LeeYeah.

6:36LeeAnd I just remember like seeing, and my dad being like, do you want to go fishing?

6:41LeeI was like, fuck off.

6:42LeeI'd end up dead.

6:43LeeWhy are you doing this to me?

6:45LeeDo you not care?

6:46AdamOr there was that one that, what's it the, the advert, advert for, um, like the warning of the dangers of fireworks.

6:52AdamWhere it was just a load of like blind kids on a hillside.

6:56LeeYes.

6:57AdamFilmed in sunlight like the end of fucking Tommy.

7:01AdamAnd there's all the, yeah, and like it's or the one where it's the kid who just holds up like their hideously bandaged, deformed giant hand where they picked up a sparkler after it went out.

7:12LeeYes.

7:13LeeThat was a terrifying.

7:16LeeBut it's funny because um yeah so in the run-up to Halloween, I've watched the Curse of the Crimson Altar, which is one of my favorite

7:25Leefilms to watch around this time of year because it's uh, it's, it's got fireworks and stuff involved.

7:31LeeBut that's the same, like they burn an effigy of a witch on a bonfire.

7:38LeeAnd it's all people who are definitely they're fully grown, they're like 50 and 60-year-old people holding rockets and Roman candles.

7:47LeeJust standing around a fire, just holding them, and then throwing fireworks into the fire.

7:52LeeAnd it's like, oh fuck, it's 1968.

7:53LeeThis is what we do.

7:55LeeAnd I'm like, there's no internet, we, you know, there's what else are you going to keep you entertained, apart from potentially killing one another with fireworks?

8:01LeeIt's mental.

8:03AdamAn uncle of mine was, uh, seriously burnt one year because, uh, I'm not sure who, my father would never tell us.

8:11AdamI've got my suspicions.

8:13AdamUm, because because one of them had put a fucking banger in his turn up.

8:18LeeOh.

8:20AdamAnd he just sort of exploded down the street like Michael Jackson hopping on one leg.

8:27LeeSeeing that your father wouldn't say who did it.

8:28LeeI think I've got my suspicions.

8:30AdamYeah.

8:31AdamHe got.

8:35AdamUm,

8:37Adamthe other, I also watched a film which I've I kind of wanted to do on the show.

8:44AdamBut now I've watched it, I can't be asked.

8:47AdamUm, called, uh, The Evil Within.

8:50AdamUm, and the story of that, the story of the film, which is the thing that is the genuinely fascinating, is that it's written and directed by, uh, one of the heirs to the Getty fortune.

9:02LeeOkay.

9:02AdamI think it's, I think it's Andrew Getty.

9:04AdamAnd he basically, obviously he's got all the money available to him.

9:09AdamSo he just made this film for about 10 years, or like sort of horror movie.

9:17AdamUh, and then was editing it for ages and ages afterwards because he was trying to get it exactly right, and he had like, what was, what he considered state-of-the-art effects and sort of things like that.

9:26AdamAnd, yeah, it's, and then he, and, but then he also was doing a lot of speed and died.

9:32AdamUh, before it was released.

9:34AdamUm, and basically, yeah, this, it is a film that looks like

9:40Adamsomeone quite rich who did a lot of speed, made a horror film.

9:45LeeRight.

9:46AdamMichael Berryman's in it.

9:49AdamWhich is always good.

9:50LeeSee.

9:51LeeYou just sold that to me on that, it looks like someone with loads of money, doesn't know what they're doing, takes loads of speed, made a film.

9:56LeeI'll be like, yeah, I'm going to watch that.

9:57AdamYeah.

9:58AdamIt is. I mean, I'm, I'm glad I saw it, but the best way I can, it's that horrible thing of you, you, you feel that you would say to them,

10:05AdamI can see what you were trying to do.

10:08AdamBut it's, it's that sort of Garth Marenghi thing where obviously it's like written by, directed by, funded by.

10:17AdamSo, yeah, it's not sort of, no, no one's at any point said, maybe don't do that bit?

10:22ChrisIt does say here that he died, um, it took him 15 years to complete. He died in 2015 and then editing was completed by producer Michael Luer.

10:32AdamYeah.

10:33AdamBecause I think that's the thing, is there was so much, there is, there is an interest in seeing it.

10:41AdamAnd I think it's going to be one of those ones that sort of becomes becomes a cult because of the surrounding story, not necessarily the actual

10:48Adamthe, the success in any way of the film.

10:53AdamUm, and

10:55Adamit does have, like the main character in it is meant to be, um, like mentally challenged.

11:04AdamAnd it gets a bit Ricky Gervais in Derek.

11:10LeeHmm.

11:11AdamI mean you sort of like you're a bit sort of, oh, no, maybe not, mate.

11:15AdamOh, that's a choice, isn't it?

11:17LeeTropic Thunder, is it?

11:18AdamWell, yeah.

11:20LeeNever go full retard.

11:23AdamIt's, it, yeah, because it's, it's more sort of, I can understand.

11:28AdamThey've obviously got, they, they have to have someone in it because of the nature of the story.

11:33AdamI won't, I won't give too much away because I don't think there's actually a plot to give away.

11:37AdamIt's kind of, yeah.

11:39AdamUm, but basically, yeah, this, this um, like disabled guy lives with his older brother and he gets this mirror that then a demon talks to him through it.

11:51AdamBut as it goes on, he has conversations with himself in the mirror, but the reflection is, and I use the term as I imagine it was used in the script, normal.

12:06AdamNo, do you know what I mean?

12:07AdamI think it's

12:08LeeOuch. Yeah, that's

12:10LeeRowan Atkinson.

12:12AdamYeah, so I think it's sort of like, yeah, so you, you do need a, you couldn't hire someone who genuinely had a condition to play the part.

12:22LeeYeah, because they'd have to play both.

12:23AdamIt's like, you know, it's like people complaining that they got someone without motor neuron disease to play, um, Stephen Hawking. And it's like, yeah, but you have to portray him beforehand as well.

12:36LeeYeah.

12:37AdamYou know, so it's a bit of a non-starter if the guy can't move.

12:41AdamSo,

12:42AdamUm, and I think this, this is in a sort of similar way.

12:45AdamBut like I say, I mean, there's a, there's a, a very, very, uh, what's the word for it, a very, uh, yeah, it's, it's, it's just a very strange film.

12:59AdamAnd like I say, the, the effects are sort of, again, it's like, oh, I can sort of see what you did there.

13:05AdamBut also, the trouble is it was effects that were state-of-the-art 15 years ago.

13:09ChrisHmm.

13:10AdamAnd everything now, there's sort of like, there's a lot of visual effects in it, but they're sort of like, oh, yeah, I've, I've got that like on Instagram.

13:16AdamIt's like a filter.

13:18AdamYou know, it'd be something like eyes for mouths for eyes and things like that.

13:27AdamAnd it's like, you know, all stuff that's pretty much taken for granted now because most people have it on their phone in one way or another like Snapchat filter or something.

13:33AdamBut,

13:34Adamyeah, I'm glad, I'm glad I watched it, but I'm also glad I didn't

13:38Adamcome, because my whole thought was is, yeah, we'll definitely have to watch this as a for the, for the podcast.

13:50AdamAnd I was going to bring it,

13:52Adamand I was going to bring it round without actually, uh,

13:59Adamwatching it myself.

14:01AdamAnd I think we'd have all had to sit there and just pick through, yeah, quite a series of problematic issues as well as, yeah,

14:09Adamdon't really know what was going on there.

14:13AdamSo,

14:13Adambut it's quite, um, yeah, I mean it's, if you're intrigued by that story, watch it.

14:18AdamBut don't, how do you heard about it?

14:21ChrisSo, how would you hear about it?

14:23AdamI'd heard about it. I think it was from, it was either Rue Morgue or Dark Side, one of the magazines like, uh, horror magazines.

14:31AdamAnd they had a review of it, but they, they had also sort of said that the whole thing with it is,

14:37Adamand that's the best way of describing it, it is basically just an old

14:41Adamlike, it, it feels very '90s.

14:45ChrisHmm.

14:46AdamAnd it feels like of that sort of era, um, but also

14:53Adamit's that sort of thing of this would have been a cheaper film, but because this guy was loaded,

15:01Adamhe can afford, he can afford to just spend.

15:04ChrisHe just spent

15:05AdamWell,

15:05AdamWell, that's the trouble, is it looks better, but then you've got something like, I don't know, beyond the Black Rainbow.

15:13AdamWhere, most of that film looks like it was shot by Stanley Kubrick on a huge budget.

15:19AdamAnd this is like, you kind of had unlimited resources, but this still is a bit shoddy.

15:23LeeOh.

15:24AdamIt's, yeah.

15:26AdamAnd like, I mean, and there's certain bits where it's like, there's no,

15:31Adamthere's a lot of technique, but not in the sense of storytelling.

15:37AdamBecause there's like one bit near the start where basically a social worker comes around to talk to the older brother.

15:44AdamAnd

15:46Adamit's shot like, like it's just the camera doesn't stop moving.

15:51AdamIt keeps like swirling round them and cutting and doing highs and lows and sort of swooping the whole time they're talking.

15:59AdamAnd they're literally just sitting somewhere talking.

16:01ChrisSo that they try and add some sort of extra.

16:03AdamWell,

16:04AdamWell, I think it was just like, oh, I fancy filming it like that today.

16:08AdamYou know, as he did another big dose of speed. And then, yeah, it sort of, um,

16:15Adamyeah, I think he's, but it felt like, it was the sort of way you'd do a countdown.

16:20AdamLike a bomb disposal countdown.

16:23AdamIt's that frenetic that you would do it to because it's like the tense exciting moment.

16:27AdamAnd it's like, this is two people having a conversation, calm down.

16:31ChrisSo you are making it sound like it's worth watching again now though, just to see what weird things that they've done.

16:35AdamMaybe at some point we'll do it for the, for the podcast then, I think. Because if you guys are interested in seeing it, it's, yeah, just to sort of go through.

16:43AdamBecause this is, this is one that you, you would feel, I mean, you know,

16:47Adamthey say you shouldn't speak ill of the dead, but you can trash the film.

16:51AdamTo a certain extent without feeling bad because, you know, he's not here to hear it.

16:59AdamUm,

17:01Adamyeah, and that's all the weather.

17:07AdamOh, and I did watch,

17:08Adamum, Dwight, Dutch, Dutch Slits's shoes, which is an episode of Shadows.

17:13AdamFeaturing a magician called Mr. Stabs, and

17:19Adamhe's a fascinating thing because there was a kid show called Ace of Wands, which was like a magical sort of a bit like a sort of Hippie Doctor Who show in the '70s.

17:26AdamAnd in in one story of that, a guy called a demon called Mr. Stabs turned up, who has the power of hand magic.

17:32AdamAnd then after that show got cancelled, he appeared in a one-off drama.

17:38AdamThis thing called Dutch Slits's shoes as part of the Shadows.

17:44ChrisDutch shoes.

17:44AdamYeah.

17:46AdamAnd then much later in like the mid '80s, they did an episode of Drama Rama.

17:50AdamAnd Mr. Stabs was in it.

17:52AdamAnd it's like, and apparently that was going to, and he's played by David Jason in the Drama Rama one.

17:56AdamIt's really.

17:57AdamAnd apparently, and I, I just like this idea is that what they were going to do was because Mr. Stabs is a villain.

18:04AdamIs they thought they were going to do a TV show, and I'm not sure quite what they mean because they no one really developed it beyond the idea, I don't think.

18:11ChrisHmm.

18:12AdamUm, but they had the concept was going to be that each week Mr. Stabs would do something and then a different hero would defeat him or be up against.

18:20ChrisI'm assuming he mostly stabs people.

18:24AdamNo, no, no, no, it's his, his name is Stabis.

18:27ChrisHmm.

18:28AdamAnd he, uh, no, he entirely magics people with his, he rhymes, everything has to rhyme because it's like he casts spells, but they all start with hand of stabs.

18:40AdamAnd, yeah, he would, and then he does these sort of very, because that's the thing, it was kind of it's a kid show and but he is an oddly menacing creature.

18:49AdamBecause he's very, he's very strange and very Victorian and very sort of absurd, but in a quite bizarre way.

18:58AdamBut yeah, they were, and but I just like that idea of a TV series.

19:04AdamBecause obviously you've got when you think about it, you've got somebody like Batman where it would be like, oh, it's the special guest villain.

19:12AdamSo it's Batman versus the Joker, it's Batman versus the Penguin or whatever, and it was going to be like, as if you did a series where it was the Joker, but one week he fought Batman and then the special guest hero would be Superman and then the special guest hero would be whoever.

19:23AdamAnd I quite like that idea because I don't know what they were going to do.

19:27AdamWhether it was going to be things like Sherlock Holmes or, you know, established fictional characters or like established heroes were going to meet him or what.

19:36AdamSo,

19:37Adambut yeah, sorry, that was just a a thing.

19:39AdamAnd I, I've waffled somewhat.

19:42AdamAnd I think that's the problem.

19:44LeeNo.

19:44LeeIt's all good.

19:46LeeUm, so I've, uh, started my Halloween viewing. So on October 1st, uh, I introduced Jennifer for the first time to Haxan.

19:57AdamOh.

19:57AdamWow.

19:58LeeYeah.

19:59LeeShe'd never seen it.

20:01LeeUm, it totally was not what she was expecting at all.

20:04LeeUm,

20:05AdamDid you do the original or the Burrows?

20:07LeeNo, the original.

20:08AdamAh, yeah.

20:09LeeUh, so, for Chris,

20:10LeeHaxan is a film from 19, blimey, I need to check fact check before I go any further.

20:18LeeUm, it's, it's super early silent black and white movie.

20:21LeeUm,

20:22ChrisHow do you spell it?

20:22AdamH A X A N.

20:25AdamWhich is German for which.

20:26Lee1922.

20:30LeeUm, yeah, and it's basically a history of witchcraft up to that point.

20:35LeeUm,

20:36Leeit's just fantastic.

20:38LeeIt's one of those, when somebody says it's nearly two hours of silent documentary about.

20:43ChrisYeah, I was going to say, like that sounds quite impressive in itself, a silent documentary.

20:48LeeIt's, it's phenomenal, it's so good to watch.

20:51LeeUm, it's

20:53AdamMaybe again, maybe we add Haxan to the list.

20:56LeeI think we should.

20:57AdamYeah.

20:59LeeIt's because it, it it kind of, it starts off quite

21:03Leeuh, quite dry to begin with.

21:06LeeBut then once it starts getting into the, so when it's somebody talking at the beginning, we're not talking, because it's silent, but if shows a card and then it'll show a photo, and then it'll show somebody pointing at things.

21:16LeeAnd it goes on like that for about 20 minutes.

21:20LeeUm,

21:21Leeand then after that, it starts actually getting into full blown, this is a witch's house.

21:26LeeThis is the stuff that goes on in here. And yeah, it's, it's absolutely fantastic.

21:30LeeIt's,

21:31Leeit's a window into, although it's all, although it's telling a historical story,

21:36Leeit's all shot in 1922, so it's a window into 1922 effectively.

21:41LeeUm,

21:43Leeso it, yeah, it just feels, it's just something about it that just feels gothic and dark.

21:48LeeAnd menacing and it's, it's a fantastic piece of film, really.

21:52AdamAnd for, and for a documentary, they do reconstructions, but they're fantastical reconstructions. So it's things like, it's things like Satan tempting priests in a church.

22:02AdamBut they obviously, so they filmed all these elements.

22:08AdamUh, because there, it wasn't like, I don't know, it wasn't like say a documentary where you'd just show clips from other movies.

22:14AdamIt was 1922 and there weren't any other movies.

22:17ChrisNo.

22:17AdamIt was, you know, so they would, so they put this, they specially filmed a lot of fantasy sequences of demons and witches and hell and uh, Sabbats and things like that.

22:33AdamAnd it's just, it's an extraordinary like just visually.

22:38AdamIt really does look.

22:42ChrisSo, even, you know, even now it can still look good.

22:46AdamIt, it looks amazing.

22:47AdamThe only thing that you, the only thing that will happen is you'll suddenly go, oh, that's in that metal video, isn't it?

22:55LeeYeah.

22:56AdamBecause it's, because it's old enough that it's gone out of print, so people sort of like, they can use it, they can use it, yeah. But so, yeah, they're sort of certain things where you're like, sure I've seen that in a ghost video or something, something one of those sort of things, yeah.

23:10AdamUm, but no, it's, I mean it's, yeah, we'll, maybe we'll do it on the show, I think.

23:15AdamBecause

23:15Adamit's

23:16Adamvery

23:16Adamdifferent.

23:16ChrisIt'd be a bit different, yeah.

23:17LeeI think we totally should. It's one of those things, I've been trying to convince Jennifer to watch for a while.

23:23ChrisI'd have thought she would have been quite up for it.

23:25LeeShe is, but I think because it's so old and it's silent and it's so long, it like it's quite an undertake.

23:32LeeYou know, like silent films are generally about the hour mark, whereas this is hour and 45, I think, it's quite.

23:38LeeUm,

23:39Leebut yeah, once we watched it, I said, and at the beginning is a little bit dry, is the problem.

23:43LeeSo if you can get past the first 15, 20 minutes, once you get into it, it's fantastic.

23:50AdamThere is a, there is also a shorter version which appeared in the '60s.

23:58AdamAnd they get the author William Burrows to do a voice over for it, so rather than the cards,

24:06Adamthey've cut it down by maybe about half an hour, I think.

24:08LeeYeah, because you'd have to cut away each time.

24:11AdamYeah.

24:11AdamSo, but it cuts it down to about an hour and a half, um, and the, uh, the extraordinary thing is William Burrows's voice.

24:19AdamWhere he just will describe it in a monotone that will make your teeth stand on end.

24:27LeeOh.

24:29AdamIt's like Tom Waits took too much Magadon.

24:34AdamThen describes to you that this is what happens when the witch's sabbath is about.

24:43AdamA goat appears and they kiss its rump as part of their pagan whatever.

24:51AdamSo yeah, that, and actually,

24:53Adamand they do a lot of, they, uh, I think that version, they color filter a lot of it.

24:57AdamNot, no, they don't colorize it.

25:00AdamThey just so rather than black and white you get like a red or a blue.

25:03AdamOr a gold.

25:04LeeOh, I was quite surprised with this actually, watching the, as I say, the original version.

25:08LeeYeah, they obviously use filters on it because some, a lot of it is sepia, but then every now and again, whenever they cut to an outside one, it'll be like a very blue looking like so.

25:15LeeBut yeah,

25:16LeeI'd be keen to, I need to watch that William Burrows one, I think.

25:18LeeBecause it's, it's totally enjoyable.

25:20AdamI think the, I think the DVD that I, I think the DVD I've got of it had both versions on there.

25:26AdamUm, but that, but I don't know, you know, whether later ones were or

25:31AdamI think because I, I think that was like a Tartan one that I got like years and years and years ago.

25:38AdamUm, and I was quite, I was quite heavily in the, well, I'm still, I'm still heavily in the Burrows, but there we go.

25:45AdamUm,

25:46AdamI was quite heavily in the Burrows at the time, so I was like, oh, all right, I'll watch that as well as.

25:52AdamSo I watched the original, and then I, I think I watched them back to back.

25:55AdamAnd, uh, yeah.

25:57LeeWow, that's quite an undertaking.

25:58AdamIt's quite an undertaking.

25:59AdamThen I remembered the birds started singing and I thought, I've got to get up now, haven't I?

26:05LeeYeah.

26:08LeeUm, so the other thing I watched, I've finally got round to it.

26:13LeeI'm not sure how much we can call it horror, um, but it it definitely launched the career of two horror directors.

26:19LeeUm, so I finally got around to watching Dead Hooker in a Trunk.

26:23AdamOh.

26:24AdamYes.

26:26LeeUh,

26:26ChrisSounds lovely.

26:28LeeYeah.

26:29LeeChris looks slightly bemused.

26:30LeeUm, so it's a comedy, it's a a super low budget independent comedy horror movie from 2009.

26:38LeeUh, made by two sisters.

26:41LeeUh, called the Soska Sisters.

26:44LeeUm,

26:45Leeand they made this like super low budget.

26:48LeeJust all the money they could scrape together.

26:51LeeUm,

26:52Leeand it absolutely blew up.

26:55LeeAnd as a result, they uh went on to do much bigger budget movies.

27:00LeeAnd they got a few TV shows and stuff.

27:02LeeAnd they're, you know,

27:02Leethey're

27:03LeeUm,

27:03Leeyeah.

27:05LeeUm, yeah, they've, they've done really well out of it as as you say.

27:10LeeAnd then it it gives hope to independent filmmakers.

27:14ChrisYeah.

27:15ChrisYeah,

27:15Christhat's great.

27:15LeeYou can go look, I'm going to get my friends, I'm going to get this video camera, we're going to shoot for nothing over a few weekends and put it all together.

27:21LeeAnd you can be noticed because this film become a cult classic overnight, really.

27:26LeeSo,

27:26ChrisWhat is like why what was it that it did well?

27:28LeeWell, the thing is, and this is what I want to cover, it doesn't do anything perfectly.

27:31LeeBut it lends well on so many things.

27:33LeeHave you seen it, Adam?

27:35AdamYeah.

27:36AdamBecause I would, like you say, it's the the horror element is questionable.

27:40AdamBecause the Soska sisters have gone on to do predominantly horror since Dead Hooker in a Trunk.

27:46AdamBut Dead Hooker in a Trunk has a bit, is a bit more like a sort of Tarantino sort of.

27:53LeeYeah.

27:54AdamLike a bit like a sort of Tarantino road movie, a bit like the start of From Dusk Till Dawn.

28:01AdamOr something like that.

28:02AdamYou know,

28:02LeeYeah.

28:03AdamSo,

28:03Adambut

28:04LeeSo the yeah,

28:04Leeyeah, sorry.

28:05LeeYeah.

28:06LeeYeah, so the plot of it is two sisters who are very different. Uh one of them is a kind of goth metal and her friend who's the lead singer in a band. Um, it's a bit of a wreck head, and the other sister, her best friend is a kind of very religious um,

28:20Leeuh, he he works in a church and stuff.

28:22LeeAnd basically all four of them are together in the car, and suddenly realized that there's a a dead hooker in the trunk.

28:29LeeAnd they don't know where it came from.

28:31LeeAnd everything just kind of unravels from there, really.

28:33LeeUm,

28:34Leeso it's, they can't decide what to do with the the corpse and everything.

28:41LeeUm,

28:42Leeand it, it,

28:43Leebut as I say, so, so what it does is it, it,

28:47Leeit's um, the script is really good, the acting is really good, the comedy is really good, the gore is really good, but it doesn't do a lot of them, it doesn't do any of those things a lot.

28:59LeeSo like, you couldn't really call it a comedy because,

29:03Leeas Adam said, it's more like a Tarantino type film, but the comedy that's in it is literally like,

29:10LeeI, I remember being conscious of how loud I was laughing at some points.

29:14LeeUm, but it's not like that all the way through.

29:16ChrisOkay.

29:17LeeAnd the fighting's really well choreographed and so, so it's one of those, it it it works perfectly for them as a showcase of

29:22Leeon absolutely no money, we can do everything relatively well, noticeably well, I think is probably about why it's written.

29:28LeeUm,

29:29Leeyeah, so it launched the Soska Sisters, uh, Twisted Twins as they're also known.

29:34LeeUh,

29:35LeeYeah, they then went on and did,

29:37Leeum,

29:38AdamAmerican Mary. I love.

29:40LeeIt's American Mary.

29:41AdamI loved American Mary. I think that's an amazing film.

29:45LeeYes.

29:46AdamUm, and they've, most recently they've done a remake of Rabid, the Cronenberg film.

29:55LeeHmm.

29:56AdamUm, which apparently was, I think was executive produced by Cronenberg.

30:01AdamSo he's quite.

30:03LeeWow.

30:03AdamYou know, he was quite happy with it by the sounds of it.

30:08AdamSo,

30:09Adamuh, yeah, and like you say, they've done lots of like, I think they've done a lot of telly, like episodes, but mainly again like genre and horror series.

30:19LeeThey did, uh, they did a thing that I called some of, it was a, I can't remember what it was called. Um, but yeah, basically it was a bit like an, like an, how you'd imagine an amusement ride.

30:26LeeAnd they'd get two people and they would put them through, uh, like a horror maze effectively.

30:32LeeAnd see how long they could make it before they shit their pants and ran away.

30:36LeeUm,

30:37Leeyeah, and it was the two of them that had come up with it and kind of, uh,

30:43Leethey were watching it on like a CCTV thing the whole time.

30:45LeeJust going, yeah, no, they're, no.

30:48LeeI reckon he's going to crap in a second.

30:50LeeLike it, yeah, and it was quite, it was, it was an entertaining show.

30:53LeeI can't remember what it was called off the top of my head, but yeah, it was very good.

30:57LeeUm,

30:58Leealso, um, a show I don't think we've mentioned on here.

31:03LeeIt kind of is horror.

31:06LeeUm, but Utopia.

31:08LeeThe British, um,

31:10AdamOh, yes.

31:11LeeYes.

31:11LeeSo I just wanted to address that very quickly.

31:13LeeSo there was a British TV show called Utopia, um, about a comic book, uh, linked to viruses.

31:22LeeUm,

31:23Leeand it was absolutely, it did two seasons, got cancelled, so it got kind of ended a little bit too quickly, unfortunately.

31:28AdamYeah, they left it on a massive cliffhanger.

31:32LeeYeah.

31:32AdamOr a massive set of cliffhangers.

31:34LeeAnd, oh, actually, it does include one of the actors who was in Sleepy Hollow as well.

31:40LeeUm, the guy, I can't remember his name.

31:41AdamThe Emperor. Ian McDermid.

31:43AdamYeah, because he.

31:44LeeYeah.

31:44AdamYeah, he's in the second series, yeah.

31:46LeeYeah.

31:47AdamYeah, the British one was incredible.

31:49LeeIt was phenomenal.

31:50LeeIt was funny and genuinely horrific.

31:55AdamYeah, genuinely dark.

31:56LeeIt left you a really hollow feeling at times, um,

32:00Leeand then other times it actually literally laughing out loud.

32:03LeeIt was in, it was an incredible show.

32:05LeeUm, and Amazon have remade it.

32:10LeeUm, and I watched the first episode to see how it compares.

32:14LeeI have never seen anything quite had the guts and the life ripped out of it quite as much as they managed to do with Utopia.

32:19LeeReally?

32:20LeeUm, I, I so,

32:21LeeI watched the first episode of them, then went back and watched the first episode of the UK series.

32:25LeeUm,

32:26Leeyeah, and they've just sanitized it so, so much.

32:31ChrisSo like what how?

32:34LeeThere's just something, I'll give you an idea, the very first episode, the very first like the opening part of season one before they've even brought up the title sequence.

32:39LeeTwo men walk into a comic book shop and kill everybody in there, one of them is a young boy of maybe seven years old.

32:44LeeAnd they just go in and

32:46Leein a very cold, like they don't brutally murder them.

32:50AdamThey don't calmly murder them.

32:52LeeYeah.

32:53LeeWhich makes it even worse.

32:54LeeAnd like,

32:55AdamYeah, don't put the gas away, yeah.

32:58LeeYeah, oh, that is, that's especially because he's given him, he's given him the raisins at the time.

33:02LeeSo like, you like, oh, he's not going to kill that kid because he's given him some food.

33:06LeeAnd then over his shoulder he goes, don't put the gas away, yeah.

33:08LeeYeah.

33:09LeeOh, it's just horrific.

33:11LeeAnd they just took all of that out of the new one.

33:15LeeUm,

33:17Leeyeah, and just made it so kind of almost family friendly. So it might turn dark later on.

33:22AdamYeah, because the original, like you say,

33:24Adamthe original did not start family friendly and it didn't, it didn't go family friendly.

33:27AdamIt was.

33:28AdamYeah.

33:29LeeIt started off dark.

33:31LeeAnd then every time you thought you got a handle on it, it got a little bit darker, but because of the comedy, you kind of, it it didn't feel like, you didn't go, you know what, this is too depressing.

33:38LeeI'm not going to watch it.

33:40LeeBecause the comedy gives it such a lighthearted element that you come away with a a really nice kind of middle, middle of the road.

33:49Leemood at the end of it, despite the fact you've been through some highs and lows.

33:53LeeIt comes out, yeah, because essentially it's a load of people who get involved in a conspiracy.

33:56AdamYeah.

33:56AdamUm, but essentially it's a load of people who get involved in a conspiracy.

33:58AdamBut they are a group of comics geeks who met in a chat room.

34:04AdamSo they don't really know each other and they're all kind of crap in their own sort of unique ways.

34:10AdamSo they are not the people to be dealing with a giant like conspiracy.

34:14LeeLike you know,

34:15LeeYeah, shady government.

34:17AdamYeah, and stuff like that, yeah.

34:19AdamAnd it's, but that, that's a lot of where the humor comes from it, is just ordinary people stuck in those circumstances.

34:26ChrisYeah.

34:27AdamUm, but the circumstances get really fucking dark in places. And but yeah, and it was,

34:34AdamI think the trouble is you saying that Lee just makes me think of, yeah, the, the, the UK version, like I say, I've not seen the US one certainly after, not after Lee's review.

34:45AdamThe UK version had such a unique feel to it, even now I don't think there was anything that, well, there's probably nothing like it.

34:52AdamBecause it got cancelled after series two.

34:55AdamSo they could decide, yeah, we'll back off from that. Um, but it had just such a unique

35:03Adamsort of view and look and sound and feel to it. And yeah, but that was the other thing that Jennifer said.

35:15LeeNo, that was the other thing that Jennifer said was, you know, she said the thing she remembered from it is it always been like it was always super bright colors and stuff. Like it almost looked like comic book.

35:25LeeIt was really, it was really bright and vibrant.

35:28AdamYeah, because because the conspiracy revolves around a graphic novel. And but yeah, like you say,

35:35Adamit is the whole thing has a lot of bits where there's like big primary colors.

35:38Adamthat feel like a splash page from a superhero comic. And yeah.

35:45AdamIf they've ordinary that up, then that's the selling point gone.

35:52LeeYeah.

35:52AdamYeah.

35:53AdamBecause if you strip it all down, it's just, oh, it's a conspiracy drama.

35:58AdamAnd they've been going since the X-Files and to varying degrees of success.

36:04LeeAnd I what I liked about this for the UK one was,

36:06Leewas the the how stylized it was. Um, the fact that the comedy was so funny.

36:14LeeAnd the fact that the bleakness literally at times left me thinking, I, I don't want to watch this anymore.

36:22LeeLike I was close to times to going, you know what, I'm going to walk away from this because it's so unpleasant.

36:26LeeBut, but then they put in a really funny bit for five minutes.

36:29LeeAnd you just kind of forget.

36:31AdamAnd and you'd also, I think you did give a shit about people, so you did want to see where people would go.

36:35AdamAnd you didn't want bad things to happen to them.

36:40LeeNo.

36:41AdamSo, I mean, I mean, the fact that there is a sequence in, I think it's in series two,

36:44Adamwhere one of the hitmen is looking for one of the conspiracy guys.

36:49AdamAnd basically, very slowly kills his boss. Um, but utterly, it's like Laurel and Hardy.

36:55LeeHmm.

36:56AdamIt's a slapstick.

36:57AdamBut it is just this thing of he keeps hitting him with a, um,

37:02Adamuh, what's it called, a fire extinguisher?

37:04LeeHmm.

37:05AdamAnd you know, and it's brutal, but also just piss funny, especially because the the guy who's getting killed is a bit of a twat anyway.

37:12LeeYes.

37:12LeeNo,

37:13AdamSo, you know,

37:14Adamit's fine.

37:15LeeSo,

37:15LeeNo, I didn't know that.

37:16LeeI didn't know that.

37:18AdamOh, no, it's a, it's.

37:20AdamUm, Claire's added another lovely message on my notes here as well.

37:22LeeOh.

37:22LeeYeah.

37:24AdamUm,

37:25Adamyeah.

37:26AdamI mean, it's, it's the thing is, I mean, but this was, this in fairness to sort of anyone involved.

37:28AdamAll this stuff with Jeffrey Jones came out after, certainly after Sleepy Hollow.

37:33AdamI think it was early 2000s.

37:36AdamYeah.

37:37AdamAnd more to the point, I haven't seen him in much since.

37:39AdamSo,

37:40Adamyou know,

37:40Adamit's, it's, um, it's not excusing it.

37:42AdamAnd it's unfortunate because he is one of those people.

37:43AdamHe is one of those sort of part of the Tim Burton rep company.

37:45AdamHe's he's only ever, he's only also in Beetlejuice and Ed Wood.

37:49AdamBut I think he's just such prominent characters in those that you just remember him.

37:51AdamHe's he's just.

37:52AdamHe's fantastic.

37:54AdamAgain, he's fantastic.

37:56AdamI think I I think Sleepy Hollow is the last Tim Burton film I saw at the cinema.

37:58AdamUm,

37:59Adamactually.

38:01AdamI think he's Ed Wood's pre-Batman.

38:04AdamBecause

38:04AdamI saw that the pictures as well.

38:06AdamIt.

38:08AdamLooks like we're according to this, it was one year after.

38:09AdamSo Ed Wood was '89, Ed Wood was '94.

38:11AdamUm,

38:12Adamso I've been saying Ed Wood is pre-Batman.

38:13AdamI'm sorry.

38:14AdamI've been saying Ed Wood is after Batman.

38:15AdamI'm saying Ed Wood is after Batman.

38:16AdamI'm saying Edward Scissorhands is pre-Batman.

38:18AdamAnd that would be incorrect.

38:19AdamBatman was '89.

38:20AdamEdward Scissorhands is '90.

38:20AdamSo Batman was before Edward Scissorhands.

38:22AdamSo I am incorrect.

38:22AdamRight, I'll, I'll, I'll, I'll just leave it at that. Yeah.

38:26AdamUm,

38:26Adamyeah.

38:27AdamI'm not, I'm not going to argue with myself on that.

38:29AdamUm, Ed Wood is '94.

38:30AdamOkay.

38:30AdamSo.

38:31AdamSo that was after Batman Returns, which was '92.

38:33AdamOkay.

38:34AdamSo Ed Wood was after.

38:34AdamYes.

38:35AdamSo my brain did get that right.

38:36AdamOkay.

38:37AdamOkay.

38:37AdamSo that was the main one.

38:38AdamSo thank you for making me. Yeah.

38:40AdamUm,

38:40Adambut yeah, so they did so, you know, it's

38:44AdamI actually, I think that's Ed Wood Scissorhands pre-Batman.

38:46AdamBecause I saw that in the pictures as well.

38:48AdamIt looks like we're according to this, it was one year after.

38:52AdamSo Ed Wood was '89, Ed Wood was '94.

38:55AdamSo I am incorrect.

38:56AdamBatman was '89.

38:57AdamEdward Scissorhands was '90, so Batman was before Edward Scissorhands.

39:01AdamSo I am incorrect.

39:02AdamRight, I'll, I'll, I'll, I'll just leave it at that. Yeah.

39:05AdamUm,

39:05Adamyeah.

39:06AdamI'm not, I'm not going to argue with myself on that.

39:07AdamUm,

39:08AdamEd Wood is '94.

39:09AdamOkay.

39:09AdamSo.

39:10AdamSo that was after Batman Returns.

39:11AdamWhich was '92.

39:12AdamOkay.

39:12AdamSo Ed Wood was after.

39:13AdamYes.

39:14AdamSo my brain did get that right.

39:15AdamOkay.

39:15AdamOkay.

39:16AdamSo that was the main one.

39:17AdamSo thank you for making me. Yeah.

39:18AdamUm,

39:19Adamyeah.

39:19AdamI'm not, I'm not going to argue with myself on that.

39:22AdamUm,

39:23AdamEd Wood is '94.

39:24AdamOkay.

39:24AdamSo.

39:25AdamSo that was after Batman Returns.

39:26AdamWhich was '92.

39:27AdamOkay.

39:27AdamSo Ed Wood was after.

39:28AdamYes.

39:29AdamSo my brain did get that right.

39:30AdamOkay.

39:30AdamOkay.

39:31AdamSo that was the main one.

39:32AdamSo thank you for making me. Yeah.

39:33AdamUm,

39:34Adamyeah.

39:34AdamI'm not, I'm not going to argue with myself on that.

39:37AdamUm,

39:38AdamEd Wood is '94.

39:39AdamOkay.

39:39AdamSo.

39:40AdamSo that was after Batman Returns.

39:41AdamWhich was '92.

39:42AdamOkay.

39:42AdamSo Ed Wood was after.

39:43AdamYes.

39:44AdamSo my brain did get that right.

39:45AdamOkay.

39:45AdamOkay.

39:46AdamSo that was the main one.

39:47AdamSo thank you for making me. Yeah.

39:48AdamUm,

39:49Adamyeah.

39:49AdamI'm not, I'm not going to argue with myself on that.

39:52AdamUm,

39:53AdamEd Wood is '94.

39:54AdamOkay.

39:54AdamSo.

39:55AdamSo that was after Batman Returns.

39:56AdamWhich was '92.

39:57AdamOkay.

39:57AdamSo Ed Wood was after.

39:58AdamYes.

39:59AdamSo my brain did get that right.

40:00AdamOkay.

40:00AdamOkay.

40:01AdamSo that was the main one.

40:02AdamSo thank you for making me. Yeah.

40:03AdamUm,

40:04Adamyeah.

40:04AdamI'm not, I'm not going to argue with myself on that.

40:07AdamUm,

40:08AdamEd Wood is '94.

40:09AdamOkay.

40:09AdamSo.

40:10AdamSo that was after Batman Returns.

40:11AdamWhich was '92.

40:12AdamOkay.

40:12AdamSo Ed Wood was after.

40:13AdamYes.

40:14AdamSo my brain did get that right.

40:15AdamOkay.

40:15AdamOkay.

40:16AdamSo that was the main one.

40:17AdamSo thank you for making me. Yeah.

40:18AdamUm,

40:19Adamyeah.

40:19AdamI'm not, I'm not going to argue with myself on that.

40:22AdamUm,

40:23AdamEd Wood is '94.

40:24AdamOkay.

40:24AdamSo.

40:25AdamSo that was after Batman Returns.

40:26AdamWhich was '92.

40:27AdamOkay.

40:27AdamSo Ed Wood was after.

40:28AdamYes.

40:29AdamSo my brain did get that right.

40:30AdamOkay.

40:30AdamOkay.

40:31AdamSo that was the main one.

40:32AdamSo thank you for making me. Yeah.

40:33AdamUm,

40:34Adamyeah.

40:34AdamI'm not, I'm not going to argue with myself on that.

40:37AdamUm,

40:38AdamEd Wood is '94.

40:39AdamOkay.

40:39AdamSo.

40:40AdamSo that was after Batman Returns.

40:41AdamWhich was '92.

40:42AdamOkay.

40:42AdamSo Ed Wood was after.

40:43AdamYes.

40:44AdamSo my brain did get that right.

40:45AdamOkay.

40:45AdamOkay.

40:46AdamSo that was the main one.

40:47AdamSo thank you for making me. Yeah.

40:48AdamUm,

40:49Adamyeah.

40:49AdamI'm not, I'm not going to argue with myself on that.

40:52AdamUm,

40:53AdamEd Wood is '94.

40:54AdamOkay.

40:54AdamSo.

40:55AdamSo that was after Batman Returns.

40:56AdamWhich was '92.

40:57AdamOkay.

40:57AdamSo Ed Wood was after.

40:58AdamYes.

40:59AdamSo my brain did get that right.

40:59AdamOkay.

41:00AdamOkay.

41:01AdamSo that was the main one.

41:02AdamSo thank you for making me. Yeah.

41:03AdamUm,

41:04Adamyeah.

41:04AdamI'm not, I'm not going to argue with myself on that.

41:07AdamUm,

41:08AdamEd Wood is '94.

41:09AdamOkay.

41:09AdamSo.

41:10AdamSo that was after Batman Returns.

41:11AdamWhich was '92.

41:12AdamOkay.

41:12AdamSo Ed Wood was after.

41:13AdamYes.

41:14AdamSo my brain did get that right.

41:15AdamOkay.

41:15AdamOkay.

41:16AdamSo that was the main one.

41:17AdamSo thank you for making me. Yeah.

41:18AdamUm,

41:19Adamyeah.

41:19AdamI'm not, I'm not going to argue with myself on that.

41:22AdamUm,

41:23AdamEd Wood is '94.

41:24AdamOkay.

41:24AdamSo.

41:25AdamSo that was after Batman Returns.

41:26AdamWhich was '92.

41:27AdamOkay.

41:27AdamSo Ed Wood was after.

41:28AdamYes.

41:29AdamSo my brain did get that right.

41:30AdamOkay.

41:30AdamOkay.

41:31AdamSo that was the main one.

41:32AdamSo thank you for making me. Yeah.

41:33AdamUm,

41:34Adamyeah.

41:34AdamI'm not, I'm not going to argue with myself on that.

41:37AdamUm,

41:38AdamEd Wood is '94.

41:39AdamOkay.

41:39AdamSo.

41:40AdamSo that was after Batman Returns.

41:41AdamWhich was '92.

41:42AdamOkay.

41:42AdamSo Ed Wood was after.

41:43AdamYes.

41:44AdamSo my brain did get that right.

41:45AdamOkay.

41:45AdamOkay.

41:46AdamSo that was the main one.

41:47AdamSo thank you for making me. Yeah.

41:48AdamUm,

41:49Adamyeah.

41:49AdamI'm not, I'm not going to argue with myself on that.

41:52AdamUm,

41:53AdamEd Wood is '94.

41:54AdamOkay.

41:54AdamSo.

41:55AdamSo that was after Batman Returns.

41:56AdamWhich was '92.

41:57AdamOkay.

41:57AdamSo Ed Wood was after.

41:58AdamYes.

41:59AdamSo my brain did get that right.

42:00AdamOkay.

42:00AdamOkay.

42:01AdamSo that was the main one.

42:02AdamSo thank you for making me. Yeah.

42:03AdamUm,

42:04Adamyeah.

42:04AdamI'm not, I'm not going to argue with myself on that.

42:07AdamUm,

42:08AdamEd Wood is '94.

42:09AdamOkay.

42:09AdamSo.

42:10AdamSo that was after Batman Returns.

42:11AdamWhich was '92.

42:12AdamOkay.

42:12AdamSo Ed Wood was after.

42:13AdamYes.

42:14AdamSo my brain did get that right.

42:15AdamOkay.

42:15AdamOkay.

42:16AdamSo that was the main one.

42:17AdamSo thank you for making me. Yeah.

42:18AdamUm,

42:19Adamyeah.

42:19AdamI'm not, I'm not going to argue with myself on that.

42:22AdamUm,

42:23AdamEd Wood is '94.

42:24AdamOkay.

42:24AdamSo.

42:25AdamSo that was after Batman Returns.

42:26AdamWhich was '92.

42:27AdamOkay.

42:27AdamSo Ed Wood was after.

42:28AdamYes.

42:29AdamSo my brain did get that right.

42:30AdamOkay.

42:30AdamOkay.

42:31AdamSo that was the main one.

42:32AdamSo thank you for making me. Yeah.

42:33AdamUm,

42:34Adamyeah.

42:34AdamI'm not, I'm not going to argue with myself on that.

42:37AdamUm,

42:38AdamEd Wood is '94.

42:39AdamOkay.

42:39AdamSo.

42:40AdamSo that was after Batman Returns.

42:41AdamWhich was '92.

42:42AdamOkay.

42:42AdamSo Ed Wood was after.

42:43AdamYes.

42:44AdamSo my brain did get that right.

42:45AdamOkay.

42:45AdamOkay.

42:46AdamSo that was the main one.

42:47AdamSo thank you for making me. Yeah.

42:48AdamUm,

42:49Adamyeah.

42:49AdamI'm not, I'm not going to argue with myself on that.

42:52AdamUm,

42:53AdamEd Wood is '94.

42:54AdamOkay.

42:54AdamSo.

42:55AdamSo that was after Batman Returns.

42:56AdamWhich was '92.

42:57AdamOkay.

42:57AdamSo Ed Wood was after.

42:58AdamYes.

42:59AdamSo my brain did get that right.

43:00AdamOkay.

43:00AdamOkay.

43:01AdamSo that was the main one.

43:02AdamSo thank you for making me. Yeah.

43:03AdamUm,

43:04Adamyeah.

43:04AdamI'm not, I'm not going to argue with myself on that.

43:07AdamUm,

43:08AdamEd Wood is '94.

43:09AdamOkay.

43:09AdamSo.

43:10AdamSo that was after Batman Returns.

43:11AdamWhich was '92.

43:12AdamOkay.

43:12AdamSo Ed Wood was after.

43:13AdamYes.

43:14AdamSo my brain did get that right.

43:15AdamOkay.

43:15AdamOkay.

43:16AdamSo that was the main one.

43:17AdamSo thank you for making me. Yeah.

43:18AdamUm,

43:19Adamyeah.

43:19AdamI'm not, I'm not going to argue with myself on that.

43:22AdamUm,

43:23AdamEd Wood is '94.

43:24AdamOkay.

43:24AdamSo.

43:25AdamSo that was after Batman Returns.

43:26AdamWhich was '92.

43:27AdamOkay.

43:27AdamSo Ed Wood was after.

43:28AdamYes.

43:29AdamSo my brain did get that right.

43:30AdamOkay.

43:30AdamOkay.

43:31AdamSo that was the main one.

43:32AdamSo thank you for making me. Yeah.

43:33AdamUm,

43:34Adamyeah.

43:34AdamI'm not, I'm not going to argue with myself on that.

43:37AdamUm,

43:38AdamEd Wood is '94.

43:39AdamOkay.

43:39AdamSo.

43:40AdamSo that was after Batman Returns.

43:41AdamWhich was '92.

43:42AdamOkay.

43:42AdamSo Ed Wood was after.

43:43AdamYes.

43:44AdamSo my brain did get that right.

43:45AdamOkay.

43:45AdamOkay.

43:46AdamSo that was the main one.

43:47AdamSo thank you for making me. Yeah.

43:48AdamUm,

43:49Adamyeah.

43:49AdamI'm not, I'm not going to argue with myself on that.

43:52AdamUm,

43:53AdamEd Wood is '94.

43:54AdamOkay.

43:54AdamSo.

43:55AdamSo that was after Batman Returns.

43:56AdamWhich was '92.

43:57AdamOkay.

43:57AdamSo Ed Wood was after.

43:58AdamYes.

43:59AdamSo my brain did get that right.

44:00AdamOkay.

44:00AdamOkay.

44:01AdamSo that was the main one.

44:02AdamSo thank you for making me. Yeah.

44:03AdamUm,

44:04Adamyeah.

44:04AdamI'm not, I'm not going to argue with myself on that.

44:07AdamUm,

44:08AdamEd Wood is '94.

44:09AdamOkay.

44:09AdamSo.

44:10AdamSo that was after Batman Returns.

44:11AdamWhich was '92.

44:12AdamOkay.

44:12AdamSo Ed Wood was after.

44:13AdamYes.

44:14AdamSo my brain did get that right.

44:15AdamOkay.

44:15AdamOkay.

44:16AdamSo that was the main one.

44:17AdamSo thank you for making me. Yeah.

44:18AdamUm,

44:19Adamyeah.

44:19AdamI'm not, I'm not going to argue with myself on that.

44:22AdamUm,

44:23AdamEd Wood is '94.

44:24AdamOkay.

44:24AdamSo.

44:25AdamSo that was after Batman Returns.

44:26AdamWhich was '92.

44:27AdamOkay.

44:27AdamSo Ed Wood was after.

44:28AdamYes.

44:29AdamSo my brain did get that right.

44:30AdamOkay.

44:30AdamOkay.

44:31AdamSo that was the main one.

44:32AdamSo thank you for making me. Yeah.

44:33AdamUm,

44:34Adamyeah.

44:34AdamI'm not, I'm not going to argue with myself on that.

44:37AdamUm,

44:38AdamEd Wood is '94.

44:39AdamOkay.

44:39AdamSo.

44:40AdamSo that was after Batman Returns.

44:41AdamWhich was '92.

44:42AdamOkay.

44:42AdamSo Ed Wood was after.

44:43AdamYes.

44:44AdamSo my brain did get that right.

44:45AdamOkay.

44:45AdamOkay.

44:46AdamSo that was the main one.

44:47AdamSo thank you for making me. Yeah.

44:48AdamUm,

44:49Adamyeah.

44:49AdamI'm not, I'm not going to argue with myself on that.

44:52AdamUm,

44:53AdamEd Wood is '94.

44:54AdamOkay.

44:54AdamSo.

44:55AdamSo that was after Batman Returns.

44:56AdamWhich was '92.

44:57AdamOkay.

44:57AdamSo Ed Wood was after.

44:58AdamYes.

44:59AdamSo my brain did get that right.

45:00AdamOkay.

45:00AdamOkay.

45:01AdamSo that was the main one.

45:02AdamSo thank you for making me. Yeah.

45:03AdamUm,

45:04Adamyeah.

45:04AdamI'm not, I'm not going to argue with myself on that.

45:07AdamUm,

45:08AdamEd Wood is '94.

45:09AdamOkay.

45:09AdamSo.

45:10AdamSo that was after Batman Returns.

45:11AdamWhich was '92.

45:12AdamOkay.

45:12AdamSo Ed Wood was after.

45:13AdamYes.

45:14AdamSo my brain did get that right.

45:15AdamOkay.

45:15AdamOkay.

45:16AdamSo that was the main one.

45:17AdamSo thank you for making me. Yeah.

45:18AdamUm,

45:19Adamyeah.

45:19AdamI'm not, I'm not going to argue with myself on that.

45:22AdamUm,

45:23AdamEd Wood is '94.

45:24AdamOkay.

45:24AdamSo.

45:25AdamSo that was after Batman Returns.

45:26AdamWhich was '92.

45:27AdamOkay.

45:27AdamSo Ed Wood was after.

45:28AdamYes.

45:29AdamSo my brain did get that right.

45:30AdamOkay.

45:30AdamOkay.

45:31AdamSo that was the main one.

45:32AdamSo thank you for making me. Yeah.

45:33AdamUm,

45:34Adamyeah.

45:34AdamI'm not, I'm not going to argue with myself on that.