- Shadow of the Vampire
00:38:34
About
It’s part 2 of our ‘Behind the scenes’ series, and we spend some time in the “Shadow of the Vampire”. A film in which we learn that Count Orlok was a pioneer of ASMR videos; a ferret is no substitute for a fresh young cameraman; and Cary Elwes can do a pitch perfect impression of Jürgen Prochnow. A wonderful blur of fact and fiction in which FW Murnau employs a real vampire to portray the lead in the silent classic “Nosferatu”, this is both a darkly comic slice of pseudo-history and a satire on the filmmaking process; with the driven director becoming an amoral monster, and his monster becoming a precious diva. An absolutely perfect cast bring this vision to life, with beautiful cinematography and loving recreations of the sublime original. Watch (or re-watch) to avoid spoilers and join us.
If it's not in frame, it doesn't exist.
Famous lines
- "Oh, the script girl. I'll eat her later."— Max Shreck
- "Good, so am I..."— Fritz Arno 'Fritzy' Wagner
- "I once saw Greta Schroeder naked."— Henrik Galeen
- "It is hardly your picture any longer."— Max Shreck
Quotes verified against Wikiquote.
Transcript
Show full transcript
LeeGood evening and welcome to horror. I'm Lee.
ChrisI'm Chris. Hi, Adam.
Leeand we are here with spoilers and swearing a plenty to cover to the year 2000. I can't believe I've seen this since I've probably since not long after it came out.
LeeShadow of the Vampire.
AdamThey make it feel a bit earlier than that though, don't they?
LeeYeah.
ChrisI I found I found my receipt in the DVD because I would have first seen it on DVD.
ChrisAnd it was 2001.
ChrisAnd it was at that point that I realized quite incidentally that that means I haven't seen it for 23 years.
LeeYeah, no, nor have I.
ChrisWhich was a shocker.
LeeYeah, and I spent the whole time thinking, why haven't I been watching this on a regular basis?
LeeYeah. Just very quickly before we jump in, sorry, I had a little bit of I had a bit of a celebrity spot today, literally 10 minutes before we started recording. Not a person, but. So the new BBC show Ludwig has just come out with David Mitchell. Episode four starts, traditional lock door mystery, man's found killed in an office, door locked from the inside with the key. So they call the janitor to come and drill out the lock.
LeeWho is the janitor? Suddenly, bloody Pablo Raybould.
AdamOh, really?
LeeYeah.
AdamOh, wow.
ChrisOf the Starling.
LeeYeah.
LeeYeah. That'd be a good smile.
AdamThat's brilliant.
AdamI for I I my money was on Andrew Elias, but.
Lee
AdamYeah, now, yeah, that's oh, no, that's brilliant.
LeeYeah.
LeeIt's only a very short, you know, maybe a minute of screen time or whatever, but yeah, it was good to see him nonetheless.
ChrisHe must have another film that we need to watch soon.
Adamwell, he did the last twitch, didn't he? Which we saw.
Adamthat was two years ago.
LeeI still haven't seen it.
LeeI actually messaged, they've got an Instagram for The Last Twitch, and I messaged and said, oh, this was about oh, 8, 10 months ago.
LeeI messaged and said, oh, I've I've missed it at the screening, can you let me know when it's going to be released or if I can buy a copy on DVD, and nobody has ever read my message.
ChrisFair enough.
AdamSo presumely, yeah.
AdamEither that or it's the classic one that someone's just locked out of their.
LeeOh, yeah.
ChrisOr, yeah.
LeeYeah, yeah.
ChrisThat happens enough.
AdamIt does.
LeeQuite possibly.
LeeSo, yes, sorry to drag us off track, but back on track.
LeeSo, Chris, I'm assuming this is your I'll just a quick we'll do a quick run down.
Leeas we're trying to bring that reintroduce that.
Leeso for anyone who hasn't seen Shadow of the Vampire, it is based around the making of the film Nosferatu.
Leebut in this world FW Murnau has in fact found a real vampire to play Nosferatu.
LeeSo Max Schreck is actually a vampire and he has come on board to make the film under the promise that in the final scene, he will get to actually turn, or not turn he says he can't.
AdamDevour.
LeeDevour, yeah, the lead actress.
Leeso with that further ado.
LeeChris, what did you make a Shadow of the Vampire?
Chriswell, if I've learned anything, it's that if it's not in the frame, it doesn't exist.
ChrisAnd that does epitomize really the obsessive quality of the director, I'd say.
Chrisso yeah.
ChrisIt's I just want to say very briefly, I've just getting out of COVID.
ChrisSo if I watched the wrong film, I have no idea what I'm talking about, anything could have happened this last week, but I've enjoyed myself so something good happened.
Chrisand when you start talking.
AdamWhen you start.
ChrisAnd if my voice.
AdamYeah.
AdamWhen you start saying about, well, you know, when the baboon got turned inside out.
AdamWe know that you've watched Cronenberg's fly.
ChrisWell, at some points.
ChrisI thought I'm watching Nosferatu again so you know, they did a great job here of really making you feel like.
ChrisYou were watching the making of Nosferatu.
AdamAnd they do use little clips of it.
AdamThere's I mean, there actually real like they used.
ChrisBut even the bits they're doing it's like it's a good it's uncanny, I would say it's quite a.
Chrisyeah, it's impressive, and funnily enough, I.
ChrisI did not realize that was Willem Dafoe as Max Schreck.
AdamClear didn't.
LeeThis is a career defining role for me, he is so good.
ChrisI could see, yeah.
ChrisYeah, it really shows how he can absolutely act very differently.
ChrisI mean like he does quite striking roles in a lot of his films, but yeah, this is it's just such a such a quirky and eerie and like there's a lot going on with him.
Chrisand and all of them like he's it's definitely an entertaining cast, and an unusual mix with with Eddie Izzard as well.
Adam
AdamI love all the sort of snuffling and stuff that he's doing as well.
ChrisLike just a bit.
AdamYeah.
LeeAnd that clicking of the nails that sounds like cicadas.
ChrisYeah.
LeeNo, just.
AdamTo be honest, at that point I tuned out because it just felt like ASMR.
ChrisYes.
AdamYou know, it's just like some some some idiot clicking their nails just to sort of.
AdamApparently make the hairs on my neck stand up.
AdamDoes not work.
AdamDoes not work for me, does not do anything for me.
ChrisYeah, so yeah, there's a lot, there's a lot going on here.
ChrisAnd you know, it's I always love a a meta film, and so essentially it's like it's it is almost like you are watching a documentary of the making of Nosferatu at points.
ChrisBut then, then it's like they're clearly telling, you know, a bigger story about art and obsessiveness and.
ChrisYou know, what it takes to try and make a film as artistic and memorable and kind of real as you can, and of course, a film about a vampire using an actual vampire. yeah, and then all the way up.
ChrisI mean, so really the final scene is where it really hits for me and and yeah, like it's you can kind of see how they've got to that point and just him.
ChrisJust the look on Murnau, you know.
AdamMurnau, yeah.
Chrisyeah, like and and the things he's saying it's yeah, that's yeah, that's fascinating.
AdamAnd we have to say that Murnau played by John Malkovich, another just it's just so so good, like you say, the intensity and that sort of drive and everything else like that.
ChrisLike it's almost that he's sort of worse than the vampire.
AdamAbsolutely, the vampire it's kind of his nature, whereas Murnau's like you should know better.
ChrisYeah.
AdamBut it's everything for the art and you know, at all costs.
AdamYou know.
AdamIt's like it's like when you see films with amoral scientists and it's sort of like this, it's like an amoral artist in a way.
ChrisHe is.
Adamfor the purpose of peace, you know, that's so.
ChrisBut in the way that, the way that the system of the film making drags them all into it as well.
ChrisIt's like they're all sort of complicit, even though they're all victims, it's like such a we're all part of this machine and we cannot stop it, you know, it's it's almost inevitability.
ChrisIt's like, yeah, we're going to carry on.
AdamWell, cuz it was early, cuz it's like a very, obviously, very early in film making, a lot of that was.
AdamThe case, it's very much like independent film making now where it's like, you know, everyone has to be in and has to be sort of obsessed in one way or another to keep to for it to keep happening and for it to be driven.
AdamSo, yeah, there's no there's no one who's turning up for, you know, an easy paycheck and you know, that's the job done for the day, it's like, no, I'm doing this because I want to make this film, I want to create this thing and, you know, whoever whoever you are as part of it, you are.
Adamsort of like, you know, a vital ingredient and you sort of channel that in. And
ChrisAnd I suppose the idea of power as well.
ChrisBecause in theory, the vampire should be the most powerful, and yet ultimately he is a tool even though literally he could have the power to, you know, kill any of them.
ChrisHe kind of needs to, he he wants to feed and he sort of wants to see through his role in a way, it's like it's an interesting I mean, I suppose it is sort of a take on, yeah, like actors rather than that it literally being a vampire.
ChrisIt is someone who wants to excel, all of them want to do their best.
Adam
AdamYeah, because he very much sort of, because it starts off that it's just oh, we've got a vampire.
AdamAnd then he kind of gets into the role and he's not he's like.
ChrisWe don't, yeah, yeah, because it's improvising.
ChrisI want to do my best for this.
ChrisYeah.
Chrisand while also wanting to actually feed on someone.
AdamThe weird thing was because there's the there's the remake of Nosferatu that's Werner Herzog with Klaus Kinski playing the count, and there's a documentary called My Best Fiend, which is Werner Herzog's documentary about all the times he worked with Klaus Kinski, and they were fucking notorious.
AdamThey were like screaming matches and storming off sets and Werner Herzog's a bloody nut case and will do mad things for a film.
AdamAnd Klaus Kinski was off his bloody chump as well.
AdamAnd but they they really liked working together.
AdamBut I mean, the first time they worked together, in the end, like at one point Klaus Kinski stormed off set, got into a boat and Werner Herzog pulled a gun on him and threatened to shoot him and then himself.
ChrisYeah.
AdamUnless he got out of the boat and continued.
ChrisYeah.
AdamSo it's like they could both bring out the absolute best in each other or ultimately completely destroy each other.
ChrisYeah.
AdamYeah.
AdamAnd yeah, so that sort of that was a thing for me where it was like, oh, because you've got they did a version of Nosferatu, and I'd imagine that to a greater or lesser extent, it probably was something along the lines of how this goes.
ChrisYeah.
AdamYou know, in the background of it.
AdamIt was just like a a very driven director and a I'm going to say loose cannon is possibly the the polite way I can put it in both cases, I suppose.
LeeI think for for me, as I say, I love this film and I I did watch it re-watching it, I was like, I can't believe I've only seen this once maybe twice.
LeeIt's such a great film.
LeeIt should be more frequently taken off the shelf.
LeeI think one of the main things for me is just the casting of this.
LeeAs you say, it's my favorite Willem Dafoe, John Malkovich is so perfect in it.
AdamOh, yeah.
LeeEddie Izzard playing Gustav.
ChrisYeah.
LeeIt's.
LeeIt it it's amazing because I I hadn't realized it until watching this, I was like, oh, Eddie Izzard is doing his faces that he pulls when he's doing his comedy shows.
LeeBut it does work perfectly the same way that he acted Nosferatu and I would would never have put the two together.
LeeBut as soon as he did it, I was like, he's perfect for the role, but he's doing his own thing and the two just merge so seamlessly.
AdamWell, it's it reminded me of the bit there's the stand up bit that Eddie Izzard did of thou shalt not steal, thou shalt not kill, thou shalt not do eight other things when talking about the Ten Commandments.
AdamAnd it's very much that sort of characterization that it's very sort of, you know, just very sort of loose the actor who's like sort of just yeah, I'm just there, I'm just doing it, you know.
AdamIn a in a way the opposite of the sort of of the driven side of things where it's very much sort of like, right, tell me where to stand, I'll do it, you know.
LeeAnd that said, I feel that's why.
AdamAnd but the effects that sort of the effect of working with a real vampire does make all the actors then that they game as well.
ChrisYeah.
LeeI thought Catherine McCormack.
LeeIs the sort of divarish female lead?
AdamYeah, Gretel Schrode, yeah.
LeeYeah.
LeeJust brilliant, really really played it well and believably.
LeeAnd yeah, just just everyone's.
LeePerformances in this sucked me in so much.
AdamI have I have to say.
AdamUdo Kier.
LeeYeah.
Adamas Albin Grau.
AdamAnd obviously, when we did Nosferatu and and, you know, I know it's a fiction thing, I'm not going to be one of those people who's like, well, actually, they wouldn't have used that car.
AdamOr well, actually, in the I mean, cuz essentially, this feels like you could be that prick on IMDb.
AdamWho fills out the Goofs section with well, actually Albin Grau didn't have his neck.
Adamsnapped by a vampire on the set of Nosferatu, he lived for some time afterwards and he went on.
AdamAnd do you know what I mean?
AdamIt's go with the fiction, you know, and everything else like that.
AdamBut like Albin Grau was much more the sort of driving force of Nosferatu like in the in the real world.
Adamas it were.
AdamBut he's but no, I just think Udo Kier is just so good as the sort of pragmatic element of it.
LeeYeah.
AdamYou know, it's like he's the producer, but at that point, the producer was the person who carries all the equipment, who does all, do you know what I mean?
AdamIt was.
Leemuch more physical hands-on role than it is.
AdamYou're you're essentially the logistics person for everything and it becomes just down to you.
AdamAnd I I think his because you've got a lot of wild performances in it, I really like him.
AdamPlaying it sort of dead straight just as an older slightly sort of like, oh, for fuck sake, what what's gone wrong now.
AdamLike a troubleshooter.
Adamcharacter as it were.
AdamAnd but I mean, but I mean, that's the weird thing.
AdamYou've got a lot of, you've got a lot of vampire heritage in here.
AdamBecause obviously Willem Dafoe is going to play the Van Helsing role in the Robert Eggers version of Nosferatu that's coming out.
Chris
Adamand Udo Kier's played played Dracula in what is it, Blood for Dracula, the Andy Warhol one.
AdamI can't remember what it's bloody called.
LeeStill not saying that.
AdamYeah, but yeah, he was yeah, Blood for Dracula.
AdamFlesh for Blood for Dracula and he's also Frankenstein in Flesh for Frankenstein and Jackal in the Strange Case of Dr. Jackal and Mr. Ozbom, which is good.
AdamFucked up, but very good.
Adamand you've also got I'm I'm going to say this wrong probably, Cary Elwes, I don't know.
ChrisYeah.
ChrisOf Elwes.
AdamWho.
ChrisYeah.
Adamthe second cameraman they get in Fritz Wagner.
LeeYeah.
ChrisSo.
ChrisYeah.
ChrisYeah.
ChrisHe is great, what have we seen him in anything else?
ChrisBecause like I recognize him from The Princess Bride and Robin Hood.
AdamYeah, he's, yeah.
AdamHe's so he's.
ChrisI wondered if he'd been never.
AdamPrincess Bride, he's in, well, he's also, he's in Bram Stoker's Dracula, he's Lord, he's Arthur Holmwood.
ChrisOh.
AdamLord Holmwood in Bram Stoker's Dracula.
ChrisOkay.
AdamSo there's a lot of people who are sort of, you know, in and out of vampire films here as well.
AdamAlso, he was in Stranger Things.
ChrisOh.
AdamThe mayor in Stranger Things.
ChrisOkay.
AdamApparently so.
ChrisI mean, I don't know if that was a a big part or not.
ChrisBut I suppose it depends.
ChrisHe was playing.
ChrisNo, no, that that must tell us that you haven't watched Stranger Things still.
AdamI haven't watched Stranger Things.
AdamI think.
AdamBecause I think the trouble is the time may have passed now.
ChrisIt's no, no, but I reckon it's got to been long enough that it's now good to go back.
LeeI think now is the time in fact.
LeeI think all the excitement's died down.
LeeI I could definitely go back and re-watch the entire thing from the beginning quite happily.
LeeVery tempted to around Halloween.
ChrisHow many series did it end up as? Three, wasn't it?
LeeThree, I think.
LeeI think they've signed a fourth I saw a post about.
LeeBut again, I don't I didn't read it, so I don't know how legitiment that is.
LeeBut yeah, I mean, the way it ended the third season was very much an ending they could walk away from, but it did leave enough open that they could very easily just reboot it straight away.
AdamFair enough.
LeeBut I'd like I would like to see a fourth season.
ChrisYeah.
LeeI thought they did a particularly good job of introducing new characters each season, not too many, but always just enough to make it feel fresh and new.
LeeAnd like you weren't just treading the same storyline.
ChrisYeah.
Leeyeah, so did a really good job on that. So I reckon if they could do that again for season four, I would definitely watch that.
ChrisThat'd be great.
ChrisSo yeah, get on that, Adam.
AdamWell, one thing.
AdamThat one thing that this has done for me though, this has solved a I don't know, 15 year, 20 year mystery for me.
Adamis so the original cameraman Wolfgang, the one who is bitten and then has to be hospitalized out.
ChrisYes.
ChrisYes.
AdamAnd the guy who plays him is called Ronan Vibert, and it was like a fucking bolt of lightning watching this, because I have been trying to work out.
AdamI had a I had a video tape, it had the last three episodes of series 2 of Drop the Dead Donkey on it.
AdamThen it had the South Bank show about Bram Stoker's Dracula, like and Dracula in general, but it was a promotion piece for the making of Bram Stoker's Dracula.
AdamSo you had like everyone from that.
AdamThat was interviewed on it.
Adam
AdamAnd then at the end of it, I had what could only be described and I'll be I am being as pretentious as I can here.
AdamA visual essay from
Adamon like and I couldn't remember what it was called and I couldn't remember.
AdamWho the presenter was, and it's this guy, it's Ronan Vibert.
Adamwho presented it, but I'd been looking up because he looks a bit like
AdamOh, what's his bloody name?
AdamAlan Rickman, he looks so at one point I thought, was that Alan Rickman.
Adamwho did that Dracula thing that I had on a tape somewhere.
AdamAnd then and then I thought it was Julian Sand.
LeeOh, yeah.
LeeI can see that.
AdamYou see that, you know what I mean?
AdamLike it's that that's that sort of.
AdamAnd then finally watching this I was like, fuck me, that's him.
AdamSo I was on IMDb, searched and then I found out it was a it was a documentary.
Adamstrand on Channel 4 called Rear Window, and it was called Dracula.
AdamThe undiscovered country.
AdamSo I was finally able to see that for the first time in fucking years.
ChrisWhich has.
ChrisOh, that's good.
AdamWell, it's good.
ChrisNice little bonus.
AdamIt was a nice little bonus for me and the I mean, the thing was is that that had a that was weird as well because what I remembered from that was that that also had a clip of a film where Lenin came back as a vampire.
AdamAnd I was trying to work out what that was.
AdamI guess that was back to the USSR.
ChrisYeah.
ChrisSquadron horror.
AdamLike a a film.
Adamand but yeah, that came from that rear window thing.
AdamSo I would suggest people go and watch that.
AdamHe's very 90s and he's he's being very sort of I don't know, Richly Grogish in it, but basically, it's just someone sitting down and reading through.
AdamA load of in inverted commas, true reports about vampirism and stuff like that from around the world over the centuries.
Adambut it was like.
AdamMixed up with loads of clips of not the obvious vampire films, you get like a bit of hammer in there, but everything else is there's loads of stuff like vamps in there and near dark.
AdamThat was where I first saw bits of near dark and things like that.
LeeOh, wow.
AdamSo it's it's got there's a lot.
AdamAnd there's still films in there that I've never seen.
LeeWhat did you say it was called, sorry?
AdamIt's called Dracula, the undiscovered country.
AdamIt's on in full on YouTube.
Adamso.
AdamSo Clare was Clare was.
AdamTreated to that the other night as well, so you can sympathize with the poor cow.
AdamSo it's it's been it's it's been a hard life.
LeeYou know.
ChrisShe vampired out.
LeeThere's nothing worse than when you've seen something and you I had the same thing, so I'm a massive fan of MR James now.
LeeBut I didn't used to be and one day I had a it was near Halloween.
LeeI had the worst hangover in the world, and I still had it at like 7 o'clock on a Sunday night.
LeeIt was a real killer.
Leeand a documentary came on about MR James.
LeeAnd I thought, oh, I'll just watch it out of interest.
LeeSparked my love of MR James.
LeeAnd therefore and rushed out and bought all of his books and watched all and went to talks about it like really got and I could never find the documentary again, it drove me nuts.
LeeAnd then I finally and the only thing I knew was, you remember the Black Adder episode.
LeeWith the executioners.
AdamYeah.
LeeSo Mr. Ploppy was the guy who was doing the narration.
AdamOh, yes, yes.
AdamI know you mean, Bill Bill something, I can't think what his bloody name is, but I know the guy you mean, yeah.
LeeOh, and I just couldn't find it for the life of me.
LeeAnd then.
AdamBill Wallace, that's it.
LeeThat's it.
LeeYeah, and then eventually, I was listening to an MR James podcast and I emailed the guys and went.
LeeHave you guys seen this, and they went, oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, that's awesome, it's an extra on so and so.
LeeAnd I was like, I've had it sitting on my shelf the whole bloody time.
AdamIs it on is it on Casting the Runes, is it?
LeeYes, it is, yeah, it's extra on Casting the Runes, I just sitting on my bloody shelf for years I've been trying to hunt it down, and I owned it.
LeeBloody.
AdamYeah, Bill Wallace.
Adamwho was Ploppy, Ploppy the jailer, and was also was also Boz the Bear in the Children Show, a bear's behind.
AdamAnd he also turns up in Black Hatter goes forth, he's the German guy in the hospital.
LeeYeah.
LeeYeah.
LeeSorry, bit of a tangent there.
LeeBut go and check that out.
AdamNo, not at all.
LeeAwesome documentaries.
AdamOkay.
AdamBut I think this is because the good thing is, I think this has the right this has the humor right.
ChrisYeah.
ChrisYeah, they don't push it too far.
AdamYeah, but it's quite it's quite dark, because I mean, the whole thing is like.
AdamI mean, essentially, it'd be like if you'd made silence of the lambs with a real serial murderer.
ChrisYeah.
AdamYou know, and you'd said to them, right, you can chew your way through the cast.
AdamAnd and also just the fact the fact that it like you said, Chris, it's like it's so it's very much more about the artistic process of film making.
AdamThan it is a vampire film.
AdamBut it's like it's like lovely touches like the writer, can't can't I just eat the writer.
AdamHe don't need the writer.
AdamThat feels very, very true.
AdamYou know, it's like the right is the poor bastard on the lowest rung where it's like you can get get rid of him, can't you?
AdamYou're not going to miss him.
LeeAnd that lovely scene when they're sitting around drinking at night and then he turns up and joins them.
LeeAnd then just snatches that bat out of mid-air and just starts eating it.
LeeAnd they're still convinced at that point that he is just a method actor.
ChrisYeah.
AdamYeah, when he walks off and they're just like, what an act.
AdamYou know.
AdamThey just think he's really messed and it's wonderful.
AdamIt is
AdamAnd.
AdamI mean that actually and I really do like that sort of thing.
AdamBecause obviously you see that this version of the vampire is living in a cave, eating ferrets.
AdamAnd you know, very reduced circumstances and that's the bit that he takes from Dracula.
AdamIs the the thing of oh, he hasn't got any servants, so he used to be a lot more powerful than he was.
AdamYou know.
AdamOr sort of and.
AdamYeah, I just but again.
AdamThat's a lovely sort of it's a weird, lovely little insight because when you think about it, it's like the whole there is that element with Dracula where you're sort of like, oh, well, it's meant to be this sort of powerful figure or whatever like that.
AdamBut actually, yeah, by the time that he's Dracula in the book.
AdamIt's it's clearly reduced circumstances.
LeeYeah.
AdamMostly on the basis that let's face it, who in the who in their fucking right mind who's local is going to go and work there.
AdamHe's going to hang around the place or anything, you know.
ChrisYeah.
AdamThey leave it off maps at that point.
AdamYou know what I mean?
Leeone of the other things I loved about this, that really stood out to me this and it's such a minor thing, but I loved it. The transitions from them behind the camera to seeing the camera where they kept pulling in so they changed it to sepia and then kind of wrote the edges of the screen in to create that kind of lens effect.
AdamYeah, when it's the the focus, yeah.
LeeYeah.
LeeI loved that, it was just it was such a nice little touch to go from behind the camera to in front of the camera, but it was just such a nice way of of going from one to the other.
LeeI just thought it was excellent, it really, really stood out.
AdamAnd I'm not sure, I mean, I don't know if the goggles thing was actually something that was a necessary part of equipment.
ChrisYeah.
Adamwhile filming.
ChrisYeah.
ChrisSo what were they?
Adamjust adds a very mad scientist.
ChrisIt does.
LeeYeah everybody on set wearing white coats like lab coats all the time as well.
AdamMind you, that was quite because it was like a technician thing, it used to be the same with recording studios, like producers would be in in white coats and things like that because it was like considered, you know, it's a technical, it's a laboratory essentially.
AdamAnd especially I suppose at that point where it was like, yeah, the camera's the lights are probably likely to explode and blow your face off, you know, things hadn't been quite as refined at that point, you know.
AdamBut the thing I the weirdest thing was is that the director of this.
AdamBecause I was like, oh, he must have done other stuff.
AdamAnd it's E. Elias Merige.
AdamNow he did a serial killer film that I'm only aware of because Clint Mansel did the soundtrack.
Lee
Adamwhich is called Suspect Zero.
AdamAnd but I was like, which interesting enough is it's a serial killer bumping off other serial killers, but it's pre-Dexter.
LeeOkay.
AdamAnd there is a thing about someone taking bodies around in a fridge.
AdamLike a refrigerated van, you know, so it was all very sort of thinking about.
AdamIt was very pre-Dexter, but very similar.
Adam
AdamBut in 1998, he did the film The Begotten.
AdamNow I don't know if you're aware of The Begotten, but it is.
LeeNo.
Adambasically, and and reading about it, he was an ex because he was like he's a theater director.
AdamAnd that's what he's mostly gone back to doing.
AdamBut The Begotten is basically, Marilyn Manson then got him to direct two videos.
AdamThat's the kind of thing that The Begotten is.
AdamThe Begotten is like you know the Clive Barker shorts, the Forbidden and the black and white student ones that he did.
LeeYes.
AdamIt's kind of in that vein.
AdamIt's like this grainy, silent art film, really gory, but really stylized and weird and like God shits out a man and then slips his throat.
AdamI mean it's fucking mental.
AdamAnd it is very much it's in that sort of same vein of yes, I would watch it late at night, but around but I'm also watching Tetsuo and a razor head.
AdamSo it was you know, but yeah, and and just to have sort of I there was no way on fucking earth I'd have put the two together.
AdamBecause this you know, this for want of a better phrase, this is classy, the other the other one's classy, but it's arty classy.
AdamAnd fucking like I say, it's very it's very art house.
AdamIt's very grim.
AdamIt's one of those things that you you could sort of it's definitely not something that you can just.
AdamPass by, it's sort of looks pretty sort of, you know, it's pretty raw, pretty weird and strange and everything.
AdamAnd I'm pretty sure it came out on like, you know, it was that label, was it Redemption or whatever like that.
LeeOh, yeah, I remember those.
AdamYeah, I think it came.
AdamI'm sure it came out on like that back in but it's like it's unavailable in most places.
AdamIt's on YouTube.
AdamBut it is like utterly, utterly unlike this in as many ways as you can be, you know, but it's but it was just a weird thing to sort of like find it's like finding you it was like finding sort of like, no, there's no there's no connection here.
AdamBut it's like, hang on, the person who's done the downward spirals just released snuffbox.
Lee
AdamYou know, or like Bat Barry's last album or something like that.
AdamYou know, it's just like, what?
AdamHow did we get I don't know.
AdamBut.
ChrisYeah.
LeeWe need to hear.
LeeSpeaking of.
LeeActually, the music stood out in this as well.
LeeFor it was such a subtle.
Adam
Leekind of underlying.
AdamYeah.
LeeIt was just wonderful.
LeeReally, really.
AdamYeah, Dan Jones, I think is the composer on this.
AdamIt's really good.
AdamActually, the original title of the film was Burnt to Light, because that's how you.
AdamThat's essentially how like filming works.
ChrisYeah.
Adamis burnt to light.
ChrisAlso, vampires are.
AdamBurnt by light.
AdamAnd it's it's the title of the opening, it's like the opening title music on the soundtrack.
Adamis called burnt to light as well.
AdamSo he obviously took took that from there.
AdamBut yeah, so that was the original.
Adamworking title of it.
AdamI think it was because I'm sure I read somewhere that someone was taking the piss and said it was like, yeah, but what's burn head to light.
AdamAnd they were like, all right.
AdamWe're going to have to change that if someone's going to.
Adambe stupid about it.
AdamWe'll change it.
AdamOne last note and especially again, feels like a lot of oddball people have been involved and everything else like that.
AdamThis is the first film that Nicholas Cage produced.
LeeOh, yeah, I saw that.
LeeCome up at the beginning, I was I was like, what the hell.
LeeBut yeah.
AdamYeah.
LeeBut having watched it, I'm like, oh yeah, of course he did.
LeeLike it's a perfect sense when someone tells you it.
AdamWell, not only that, but also the sort of like, what the a strange man who's really who really wants to give you a great performance.
LeeYeah.
AdamWhat what first drew you to the project, Nicholas Cage?
Leebut yeah, I'm so glad that we did this because it is it's one of those films I watched, loved, and we've mentioned it so many times.
LeeBut I just never go back and rewatch it, and then when I did, I was like, oh, you're an idiot, how is this sat on the shelf for so long and not come out for, you know, at least every couple of years.
LeeIt's it will be from now on.
LeeWithout a doubt.
AdamNo, I was much the same, much the same.
ChrisIt does feel like you need to watch Nosferatu first.
ChrisLike at least once.
ChrisYou know.
ChrisBut also it seems like potentially you could do both.
AdamYou know what the.
AdamYeah.
AdamBut I think that weirdly enough, though, we did it as although it's like the the link with this with late night and the devil and this was behind the scenes.
AdamI think it's actually also oh, it's it's kind of like fake history.
LeeYeah.
AdamOr or alternate cool history or something like that.
AdamWhere it's like, well, here's what here's the real thing, but what if it was a vampire, that'd be.
ChrisYeah.
AdamWouldn't it.
AdamAnd similarly, you know, it's like.
AdamWell, here's here's the Johnny Carson show, but what if he did actually get someone out who's possessed, you know.
ChrisAnd and really.
ChrisWatching Nosferatu, you know, you could believe that they did use a real vampire.
ChrisIt certainly you know, it's strange enough.
AdamI think it was one of those things like there was a lot of myths around it.
AdamBecause he's called Max Schreck as well, which is like fear in German.
AdamSo loads of people just thought it was a pseudonym.
ChrisYeah.
AdamAnd so again, there were like, well, I I say rumors, I'm going to say playground rumors.
LeeYeah.
AdamBecause that's what it feels like.
AdamBut he's a real vampire, they got a real vampire, he played a real vampire.
AdamHe got played the vampire in that it was my mate telling me that.
AdamAnd he's and he's dead's got a pouch, but he only takes it out of weekends.
AdamAnd after dark.
LeeYeah.
LeeI think I'm sure I heard somewhere, and again, it could have just been a similar rumor.
LeeCuz I I can't for the life of me remember where, but I'm sure I heard something saying that Max Shrek, yeah, did only turn up on set for his, you know, didn't hang out with the crew and do that stuff, and he did just turn up and shoot his scenes and then disappeared.
LeeBut again, that might be.
LeeMe misremembering it or somebody passing on false information or somebody confusing this film with what actually.
ChrisOh, yeah.
ChrisYeah.
ChrisYeah, that could exist.
AdamWell, cuz not that, but also I suppose there's there's the there's the element of it if if someone's having like a load of make up put on, especially like in the early days of that sort of thing, it probably was most of the time it was, right, you go off to the makeup and have your nose redone and have your have your nails redone because they've fallen out.
AdamAnd, you know, so he's probably spending most of his time in makeup, while everyone else is sitting around in the middle of stuff being changed.
AdamAnd things like that, so it's very possible that he never saw anyone.
Adambecause the poor bugger spent most of his time having his like mask done and everything.
LeeI mean, he is touched up on.
AdamFilthy swine.
Lee
LeeYeah, so I mean, 100% recommend this film.
LeeI just I yeah, I thoroughly enjoyed it more than I thought I was going to and I was very much looking forward to seeing it again.
LeeSo.
LeeYeah, this is a this is a great way to start our Halloween viewing really this year.
Adam
LeeSo on that note, we're going to be back in a Fortnight's time.
LeeWe're going to do something a bit different.
Leewe have decided that as Chris is no longer being welcomed to horror, being 250 plus movies in by this point, including stuff he watched for.
ChrisThat's that's quite a few, isn't it?
LeeThat's yeah, that's a considerable amount.
Lee
LeeSo we thought it would be nice, rather than covering a film, to sit down with Chris and just, yeah.
LeeGive him a chance to do us a bit of a retrospective, what of his highlights been of the last 200 episodes, what subgenres he's discovered, what things he's found that he really liked, what he doesn't like.
LeeSo we're just going to kind of sit down and just have a general horror discussion, yeah, about everything that Chris has learned.
LeeThere will be a test.
LeeIt will go on your permanent record.
AdamAnd and we reserve the right that you may sit on the council but you are not granted the the position of.
ChrisSo.
AdamSo just just just getting that out there quick.
AdamBecause that went well for the last people who said that.
AdamThat went really fucking well for them, you know.
LeeYeah, that sounds great.
LeeYeah.
LeeYeah.
LeeYeah.
ChrisWe don't need to worry about consistency or integrity.
LeeNo.
ChrisOr any of those.
LeeDon't.
AdamI.
LeeDon't.
LeeDon't.
LeeSo when this episode comes out, there's going to be about a week or so before we record again.
Leeso if anyone has any questions that they'd like to send in for Chris, please obviously send them to our email info@welcometohorror.com.
Leeor contact us on our social, DM us on there and ask Chris any questions you would like to ask him or get his opinions on.
Leeyeah, and we will be back in a Fortnight's time for that.
LeeThanks very much for listening.
LeeGood night.
ChrisGood night.
AdamNaty night.
