- Shadow of the Vampire

0:25 Lee Good evening and welcome to horror. I'm Lee.

0:28 Chris I'm Chris. Hi, Adam.

0:31 Lee and we are here with spoilers and swearing a plenty to cover to the year 2000. I can't believe I've seen this since I've probably since not long after it came out.

0:44 Lee Shadow of the Vampire.

0:48 Adam They make it feel a bit earlier than that though, don't they?

0:50 Lee Yeah.

0:52 Chris I I found I found my receipt in the DVD because I would have first seen it on DVD.

0:59 Chris And it was 2001.

1:02 Chris And it was at that point that I realized quite incidentally that that means I haven't seen it for 23 years.

1:10 Lee Yeah, no, nor have I.

1:12 Chris Which was a shocker.

1:13 Lee Yeah, and I spent the whole time thinking, why haven't I been watching this on a regular basis?

1:18 Lee Yeah. Just very quickly before we jump in, sorry, I had a little bit of I had a bit of a celebrity spot today, literally 10 minutes before we started recording. Not a person, but. So the new BBC show Ludwig has just come out with David Mitchell. Episode four starts, traditional lock door mystery, man's found killed in an office, door locked from the inside with the key. So they call the janitor to come and drill out the lock.

1:49 Lee Who is the janitor? Suddenly, bloody Pablo Raybould.

1:59 Adam Oh, really?

2:00 Lee Yeah.

2:01 Adam Oh, wow.

2:02 Chris Of the Starling.

2:03 Lee Yeah.

2:04 Lee Yeah. That'd be a good smile.

2:06 Adam That's brilliant.

2:08 Adam I for I I my money was on Andrew Elias, but.

2:12 Lee

2:12 Adam Yeah, now, yeah, that's oh, no, that's brilliant.

2:16 Lee Yeah.

2:17 Lee It's only a very short, you know, maybe a minute of screen time or whatever, but yeah, it was good to see him nonetheless.

2:22 Chris He must have another film that we need to watch soon.

2:27 Adam well, he did the last twitch, didn't he? Which we saw.

2:31 Adam that was two years ago.

2:35 Lee I still haven't seen it.

2:36 Lee I actually messaged, they've got an Instagram for The Last Twitch, and I messaged and said, oh, this was about oh, 8, 10 months ago.

2:44 Lee I messaged and said, oh, I've I've missed it at the screening, can you let me know when it's going to be released or if I can buy a copy on DVD, and nobody has ever read my message.

2:54 Chris Fair enough.

2:56 Adam So presumely, yeah.

2:58 Adam Either that or it's the classic one that someone's just locked out of their.

3:02 Lee Oh, yeah.

3:02 Chris Or, yeah.

3:03 Lee Yeah, yeah.

3:04 Chris That happens enough.

3:06 Adam It does.

3:07 Lee Quite possibly.

3:07 Lee So, yes, sorry to drag us off track, but back on track.

3:12 Lee So, Chris, I'm assuming this is your I'll just a quick we'll do a quick run down.

3:16 Lee as we're trying to bring that reintroduce that.

3:19 Lee so for anyone who hasn't seen Shadow of the Vampire, it is based around the making of the film Nosferatu.

3:27 Lee but in this world FW Murnau has in fact found a real vampire to play Nosferatu.

3:33 Lee So Max Schreck is actually a vampire and he has come on board to make the film under the promise that in the final scene, he will get to actually turn, or not turn he says he can't.

3:42 Adam Devour.

3:43 Lee Devour, yeah, the lead actress.

3:46 Lee so with that further ado.

3:49 Lee Chris, what did you make a Shadow of the Vampire?

3:51 Chris well, if I've learned anything, it's that if it's not in the frame, it doesn't exist.

3:56 Chris And that does epitomize really the obsessive quality of the director, I'd say.

4:03 Chris so yeah.

4:04 Chris It's I just want to say very briefly, I've just getting out of COVID.

4:08 Chris So if I watched the wrong film, I have no idea what I'm talking about, anything could have happened this last week, but I've enjoyed myself so something good happened.

4:16 Chris and when you start talking.

4:17 Adam When you start.

4:18 Chris And if my voice.

4:19 Adam Yeah.

4:19 Adam When you start saying about, well, you know, when the baboon got turned inside out.

4:23 Adam We know that you've watched Cronenberg's fly.

4:24 Chris Well, at some points.

4:26 Chris I thought I'm watching Nosferatu again so you know, they did a great job here of really making you feel like.

4:30 Chris You were watching the making of Nosferatu.

4:35 Adam And they do use little clips of it.

4:36 Adam There's I mean, there actually real like they used.

4:40 Chris But even the bits they're doing it's like it's a good it's uncanny, I would say it's quite a.

4:45 Chris yeah, it's impressive, and funnily enough, I.

4:49 Chris I did not realize that was Willem Dafoe as Max Schreck.

4:53 Adam Clear didn't.

4:54 Lee This is a career defining role for me, he is so good.

4:58 Chris I could see, yeah.

5:00 Chris Yeah, it really shows how he can absolutely act very differently.

5:04 Chris I mean like he does quite striking roles in a lot of his films, but yeah, this is it's just such a such a quirky and eerie and like there's a lot going on with him.

5:13 Chris and and all of them like he's it's definitely an entertaining cast, and an unusual mix with with Eddie Izzard as well.

5:22 Adam

5:23 Adam I love all the sort of snuffling and stuff that he's doing as well.

5:26 Chris Like just a bit.

5:28 Adam Yeah.

5:30 Lee And that clicking of the nails that sounds like cicadas.

5:33 Chris Yeah.

5:34 Lee No, just.

5:36 Adam To be honest, at that point I tuned out because it just felt like ASMR.

5:41 Chris Yes.

5:41 Adam You know, it's just like some some some idiot clicking their nails just to sort of.

5:48 Adam Apparently make the hairs on my neck stand up.

5:52 Adam Does not work.

5:53 Adam Does not work for me, does not do anything for me.

5:58 Chris Yeah, so yeah, there's a lot, there's a lot going on here.

6:01 Chris And you know, it's I always love a a meta film, and so essentially it's like it's it is almost like you are watching a documentary of the making of Nosferatu at points.

6:13 Chris But then, then it's like they're clearly telling, you know, a bigger story about art and obsessiveness and.

6:21 Chris You know, what it takes to try and make a film as artistic and memorable and kind of real as you can, and of course, a film about a vampire using an actual vampire. yeah, and then all the way up.

6:34 Chris I mean, so really the final scene is where it really hits for me and and yeah, like it's you can kind of see how they've got to that point and just him.

6:48 Chris Just the look on Murnau, you know.

6:54 Adam Murnau, yeah.

6:55 Chris yeah, like and and the things he's saying it's yeah, that's yeah, that's fascinating.

7:00 Adam And we have to say that Murnau played by John Malkovich, another just it's just so so good, like you say, the intensity and that sort of drive and everything else like that.

7:14 Chris Like it's almost that he's sort of worse than the vampire.

7:20 Adam Absolutely, the vampire it's kind of his nature, whereas Murnau's like you should know better.

7:25 Chris Yeah.

7:26 Adam But it's everything for the art and you know, at all costs.

7:31 Adam You know.

7:31 Adam It's like it's like when you see films with amoral scientists and it's sort of like this, it's like an amoral artist in a way.

7:38 Chris He is.

7:38 Adam for the purpose of peace, you know, that's so.

7:41 Chris But in the way that, the way that the system of the film making drags them all into it as well.

7:46 Chris It's like they're all sort of complicit, even though they're all victims, it's like such a we're all part of this machine and we cannot stop it, you know, it's it's almost inevitability.

7:56 Chris It's like, yeah, we're going to carry on.

7:58 Adam Well, cuz it was early, cuz it's like a very, obviously, very early in film making, a lot of that was.

8:04 Adam The case, it's very much like independent film making now where it's like, you know, everyone has to be in and has to be sort of obsessed in one way or another to keep to for it to keep happening and for it to be driven.

8:24 Adam So, yeah, there's no there's no one who's turning up for, you know, an easy paycheck and you know, that's the job done for the day, it's like, no, I'm doing this because I want to make this film, I want to create this thing and, you know, whoever whoever you are as part of it, you are.

8:39 Adam sort of like, you know, a vital ingredient and you sort of channel that in. And

8:48 Chris And I suppose the idea of power as well.

8:51 Chris Because in theory, the vampire should be the most powerful, and yet ultimately he is a tool even though literally he could have the power to, you know, kill any of them.

9:01 Chris He kind of needs to, he he wants to feed and he sort of wants to see through his role in a way, it's like it's an interesting I mean, I suppose it is sort of a take on, yeah, like actors rather than that it literally being a vampire.

9:11 Chris It is someone who wants to excel, all of them want to do their best.

9:16 Adam

9:17 Adam Yeah, because he very much sort of, because it starts off that it's just oh, we've got a vampire.

9:24 Adam And then he kind of gets into the role and he's not he's like.

9:28 Chris We don't, yeah, yeah, because it's improvising.

9:30 Chris I want to do my best for this.

9:30 Chris Yeah.

9:32 Chris and while also wanting to actually feed on someone.

9:37 Adam The weird thing was because there's the there's the remake of Nosferatu that's Werner Herzog with Klaus Kinski playing the count, and there's a documentary called My Best Fiend, which is Werner Herzog's documentary about all the times he worked with Klaus Kinski, and they were fucking notorious.

9:57 Adam They were like screaming matches and storming off sets and Werner Herzog's a bloody nut case and will do mad things for a film.

10:05 Adam And Klaus Kinski was off his bloody chump as well.

10:09 Adam And but they they really liked working together.

10:12 Adam But I mean, the first time they worked together, in the end, like at one point Klaus Kinski stormed off set, got into a boat and Werner Herzog pulled a gun on him and threatened to shoot him and then himself.

10:24 Chris Yeah.

10:25 Adam Unless he got out of the boat and continued.

10:27 Chris Yeah.

10:28 Adam So it's like they could both bring out the absolute best in each other or ultimately completely destroy each other.

10:32 Chris Yeah.

10:33 Adam Yeah.

10:34 Adam And yeah, so that sort of that was a thing for me where it was like, oh, because you've got they did a version of Nosferatu, and I'd imagine that to a greater or lesser extent, it probably was something along the lines of how this goes.

10:50 Chris Yeah.

10:51 Adam You know, in the background of it.

10:53 Adam It was just like a a very driven director and a I'm going to say loose cannon is possibly the the polite way I can put it in both cases, I suppose.

11:09 Lee I think for for me, as I say, I love this film and I I did watch it re-watching it, I was like, I can't believe I've only seen this once maybe twice.

11:20 Lee It's such a great film.

11:24 Lee It should be more frequently taken off the shelf.

11:30 Lee I think one of the main things for me is just the casting of this.

11:33 Lee As you say, it's my favorite Willem Dafoe, John Malkovich is so perfect in it.

11:40 Adam Oh, yeah.

11:41 Lee Eddie Izzard playing Gustav.

11:43 Chris Yeah.

11:44 Lee It's.

11:45 Lee It it it's amazing because I I hadn't realized it until watching this, I was like, oh, Eddie Izzard is doing his faces that he pulls when he's doing his comedy shows.

11:56 Lee But it does work perfectly the same way that he acted Nosferatu and I would would never have put the two together.

12:03 Lee But as soon as he did it, I was like, he's perfect for the role, but he's doing his own thing and the two just merge so seamlessly.

12:12 Adam Well, it's it reminded me of the bit there's the stand up bit that Eddie Izzard did of thou shalt not steal, thou shalt not kill, thou shalt not do eight other things when talking about the Ten Commandments.

12:27 Adam And it's very much that sort of characterization that it's very sort of, you know, just very sort of loose the actor who's like sort of just yeah, I'm just there, I'm just doing it, you know.

12:40 Adam In a in a way the opposite of the sort of of the driven side of things where it's very much sort of like, right, tell me where to stand, I'll do it, you know.

12:51 Lee And that said, I feel that's why.

12:51 Adam And but the effects that sort of the effect of working with a real vampire does make all the actors then that they game as well.

13:00 Chris Yeah.

13:01 Lee I thought Catherine McCormack.

13:02 Lee Is the sort of divarish female lead?

13:05 Adam Yeah, Gretel Schrode, yeah.

13:07 Lee Yeah.

13:07 Lee Just brilliant, really really played it well and believably.

13:13 Lee And yeah, just just everyone's.

13:14 Lee Performances in this sucked me in so much.

13:18 Adam I have I have to say.

13:19 Adam Udo Kier.

13:21 Lee Yeah.

13:21 Adam as Albin Grau.

13:23 Adam And obviously, when we did Nosferatu and and, you know, I know it's a fiction thing, I'm not going to be one of those people who's like, well, actually, they wouldn't have used that car.

13:33 Adam Or well, actually, in the I mean, cuz essentially, this feels like you could be that prick on IMDb.

13:40 Adam Who fills out the Goofs section with well, actually Albin Grau didn't have his neck.

13:44 Adam snapped by a vampire on the set of Nosferatu, he lived for some time afterwards and he went on.

13:49 Adam And do you know what I mean?

13:50 Adam It's go with the fiction, you know, and everything else like that.

13:54 Adam But like Albin Grau was much more the sort of driving force of Nosferatu like in the in the real world.

14:03 Adam as it were.

14:04 Adam But he's but no, I just think Udo Kier is just so good as the sort of pragmatic element of it.

14:12 Lee Yeah.

14:13 Adam You know, it's like he's the producer, but at that point, the producer was the person who carries all the equipment, who does all, do you know what I mean?

14:22 Adam It was.

14:23 Lee much more physical hands-on role than it is.

14:28 Adam You're you're essentially the logistics person for everything and it becomes just down to you.

14:34 Adam And I I think his because you've got a lot of wild performances in it, I really like him.

14:43 Adam Playing it sort of dead straight just as an older slightly sort of like, oh, for fuck sake, what what's gone wrong now.

14:54 Adam Like a troubleshooter.

14:55 Adam character as it were.

14:57 Adam And but I mean, but I mean, that's the weird thing.

15:03 Adam You've got a lot of, you've got a lot of vampire heritage in here.

15:07 Adam Because obviously Willem Dafoe is going to play the Van Helsing role in the Robert Eggers version of Nosferatu that's coming out.

15:15 Chris

15:17 Adam and Udo Kier's played played Dracula in what is it, Blood for Dracula, the Andy Warhol one.

15:25 Adam I can't remember what it's bloody called.

15:26 Lee Still not saying that.

15:27 Adam Yeah, but yeah, he was yeah, Blood for Dracula.

15:32 Adam Flesh for Blood for Dracula and he's also Frankenstein in Flesh for Frankenstein and Jackal in the Strange Case of Dr. Jackal and Mr. Ozbom, which is good.

15:40 Adam Fucked up, but very good.

15:42 Adam and you've also got I'm I'm going to say this wrong probably, Cary Elwes, I don't know.

15:51 Chris Yeah.

15:52 Chris Of Elwes.

15:53 Adam Who.

15:54 Chris Yeah.

15:55 Adam the second cameraman they get in Fritz Wagner.

15:59 Lee Yeah.

16:00 Chris So.

16:01 Chris Yeah.

16:01 Chris Yeah.

16:02 Chris He is great, what have we seen him in anything else?

16:04 Chris Because like I recognize him from The Princess Bride and Robin Hood.

16:07 Adam Yeah, he's, yeah.

16:08 Adam He's so he's.

16:09 Chris I wondered if he'd been never.

16:10 Adam Princess Bride, he's in, well, he's also, he's in Bram Stoker's Dracula, he's Lord, he's Arthur Holmwood.

16:16 Chris Oh.

16:17 Adam Lord Holmwood in Bram Stoker's Dracula.

16:21 Chris Okay.

16:21 Adam So there's a lot of people who are sort of, you know, in and out of vampire films here as well.

16:26 Adam Also, he was in Stranger Things.

16:29 Chris Oh.

16:29 Adam The mayor in Stranger Things.

16:31 Chris Okay.

16:32 Adam Apparently so.

16:33 Chris I mean, I don't know if that was a a big part or not.

16:36 Chris But I suppose it depends.

16:37 Chris He was playing.

16:37 Chris No, no, that that must tell us that you haven't watched Stranger Things still.

16:40 Adam I haven't watched Stranger Things.

16:40 Adam I think.

16:41 Adam Because I think the trouble is the time may have passed now.

16:43 Chris It's no, no, but I reckon it's got to been long enough that it's now good to go back.

16:46 Lee I think now is the time in fact.

16:48 Lee I think all the excitement's died down.

16:51 Lee I I could definitely go back and re-watch the entire thing from the beginning quite happily.

16:56 Lee Very tempted to around Halloween.

16:59 Chris How many series did it end up as? Three, wasn't it?

17:01 Lee Three, I think.

17:02 Lee I think they've signed a fourth I saw a post about.

17:06 Lee But again, I don't I didn't read it, so I don't know how legitiment that is.

17:12 Lee But yeah, I mean, the way it ended the third season was very much an ending they could walk away from, but it did leave enough open that they could very easily just reboot it straight away.

17:24 Adam Fair enough.

17:26 Lee But I'd like I would like to see a fourth season.

17:29 Chris Yeah.

17:31 Lee I thought they did a particularly good job of introducing new characters each season, not too many, but always just enough to make it feel fresh and new.

17:41 Lee And like you weren't just treading the same storyline.

17:45 Chris Yeah.

17:46 Lee yeah, so did a really good job on that. So I reckon if they could do that again for season four, I would definitely watch that.

17:52 Chris That'd be great.

17:53 Chris So yeah, get on that, Adam.

17:55 Adam Well, one thing.

17:56 Adam That one thing that this has done for me though, this has solved a I don't know, 15 year, 20 year mystery for me.

18:06 Adam is so the original cameraman Wolfgang, the one who is bitten and then has to be hospitalized out.

18:11 Chris Yes.

18:12 Chris Yes.

18:15 Adam And the guy who plays him is called Ronan Vibert, and it was like a fucking bolt of lightning watching this, because I have been trying to work out.

18:29 Adam I had a I had a video tape, it had the last three episodes of series 2 of Drop the Dead Donkey on it.

18:33 Adam Then it had the South Bank show about Bram Stoker's Dracula, like and Dracula in general, but it was a promotion piece for the making of Bram Stoker's Dracula.

18:42 Adam So you had like everyone from that.

18:44 Adam That was interviewed on it.

18:44 Adam

18:45 Adam And then at the end of it, I had what could only be described and I'll be I am being as pretentious as I can here.

18:53 Adam A visual essay from

18:56 Adam on like and I couldn't remember what it was called and I couldn't remember.

19:01 Adam Who the presenter was, and it's this guy, it's Ronan Vibert.

19:05 Adam who presented it, but I'd been looking up because he looks a bit like

19:10 Adam Oh, what's his bloody name?

19:12 Adam Alan Rickman, he looks so at one point I thought, was that Alan Rickman.

19:16 Adam who did that Dracula thing that I had on a tape somewhere.

19:21 Adam And then and then I thought it was Julian Sand.

19:25 Lee Oh, yeah.

19:26 Lee I can see that.

19:27 Adam You see that, you know what I mean?

19:28 Adam Like it's that that's that sort of.

19:30 Adam And then finally watching this I was like, fuck me, that's him.

19:32 Adam So I was on IMDb, searched and then I found out it was a it was a documentary.

19:36 Adam strand on Channel 4 called Rear Window, and it was called Dracula.

19:39 Adam The undiscovered country.

19:42 Adam So I was finally able to see that for the first time in fucking years.

19:47 Chris Which has.

19:48 Chris Oh, that's good.

19:48 Adam Well, it's good.

19:50 Chris Nice little bonus.

19:51 Adam It was a nice little bonus for me and the I mean, the thing was is that that had a that was weird as well because what I remembered from that was that that also had a clip of a film where Lenin came back as a vampire.

20:10 Adam And I was trying to work out what that was.

20:11 Adam I guess that was back to the USSR.

20:12 Chris Yeah.

20:12 Chris Squadron horror.

20:14 Adam Like a a film.

20:17 Adam and but yeah, that came from that rear window thing.

20:20 Adam So I would suggest people go and watch that.

20:22 Adam He's very 90s and he's he's being very sort of I don't know, Richly Grogish in it, but basically, it's just someone sitting down and reading through.

20:32 Adam A load of in inverted commas, true reports about vampirism and stuff like that from around the world over the centuries.

20:41 Adam but it was like.

20:42 Adam Mixed up with loads of clips of not the obvious vampire films, you get like a bit of hammer in there, but everything else is there's loads of stuff like vamps in there and near dark.

20:51 Adam That was where I first saw bits of near dark and things like that.

20:53 Lee Oh, wow.

20:53 Adam So it's it's got there's a lot.

20:55 Adam And there's still films in there that I've never seen.

20:58 Lee What did you say it was called, sorry?

20:59 Adam It's called Dracula, the undiscovered country.

21:02 Adam It's on in full on YouTube.

21:05 Adam so.

21:06 Adam So Clare was Clare was.

21:07 Adam Treated to that the other night as well, so you can sympathize with the poor cow.

21:12 Adam So it's it's been it's it's been a hard life.

21:16 Lee You know.

21:16 Chris She vampired out.

21:18 Lee There's nothing worse than when you've seen something and you I had the same thing, so I'm a massive fan of MR James now.

21:25 Lee But I didn't used to be and one day I had a it was near Halloween.

21:30 Lee I had the worst hangover in the world, and I still had it at like 7 o'clock on a Sunday night.

21:36 Lee It was a real killer.

21:38 Lee and a documentary came on about MR James.

21:41 Lee And I thought, oh, I'll just watch it out of interest.

21:45 Lee Sparked my love of MR James.

21:47 Lee And therefore and rushed out and bought all of his books and watched all and went to talks about it like really got and I could never find the documentary again, it drove me nuts.

21:59 Lee And then I finally and the only thing I knew was, you remember the Black Adder episode.

22:04 Lee With the executioners.

22:07 Adam Yeah.

22:08 Lee So Mr. Ploppy was the guy who was doing the narration.

22:13 Adam Oh, yes, yes.

22:13 Adam I know you mean, Bill Bill something, I can't think what his bloody name is, but I know the guy you mean, yeah.

22:18 Lee Oh, and I just couldn't find it for the life of me.

22:21 Lee And then.

22:22 Adam Bill Wallace, that's it.

22:24 Lee That's it.

22:25 Lee Yeah, and then eventually, I was listening to an MR James podcast and I emailed the guys and went.

22:31 Lee Have you guys seen this, and they went, oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, that's awesome, it's an extra on so and so.

22:37 Lee And I was like, I've had it sitting on my shelf the whole bloody time.

22:42 Adam Is it on is it on Casting the Runes, is it?

22:44 Lee Yes, it is, yeah, it's extra on Casting the Runes, I just sitting on my bloody shelf for years I've been trying to hunt it down, and I owned it.

22:52 Lee Bloody.

22:53 Adam Yeah, Bill Wallace.

22:54 Adam who was Ploppy, Ploppy the jailer, and was also was also Boz the Bear in the Children Show, a bear's behind.

23:01 Adam And he also turns up in Black Hatter goes forth, he's the German guy in the hospital.

23:06 Lee Yeah.

23:07 Lee Yeah.

23:09 Lee Sorry, bit of a tangent there.

23:10 Lee But go and check that out.

23:12 Adam No, not at all.

23:12 Lee Awesome documentaries.

23:15 Adam Okay.

23:15 Adam But I think this is because the good thing is, I think this has the right this has the humor right.

23:21 Chris Yeah.

23:23 Chris Yeah, they don't push it too far.

23:24 Adam Yeah, but it's quite it's quite dark, because I mean, the whole thing is like.

23:29 Adam I mean, essentially, it'd be like if you'd made silence of the lambs with a real serial murderer.

23:36 Chris Yeah.

23:37 Adam You know, and you'd said to them, right, you can chew your way through the cast.

23:44 Adam And and also just the fact the fact that it like you said, Chris, it's like it's so it's very much more about the artistic process of film making.

23:54 Adam Than it is a vampire film.

23:55 Adam But it's like it's like lovely touches like the writer, can't can't I just eat the writer.

24:02 Adam He don't need the writer.

24:04 Adam That feels very, very true.

24:05 Adam You know, it's like the right is the poor bastard on the lowest rung where it's like you can get get rid of him, can't you?

24:09 Adam You're not going to miss him.

24:11 Lee And that lovely scene when they're sitting around drinking at night and then he turns up and joins them.

24:15 Lee And then just snatches that bat out of mid-air and just starts eating it.

24:18 Lee And they're still convinced at that point that he is just a method actor.

24:21 Chris Yeah.

24:21 Adam Yeah, when he walks off and they're just like, what an act.

24:24 Adam You know.

24:25 Adam They just think he's really messed and it's wonderful.

24:29 Adam It is

24:31 Adam And.

24:33 Adam I mean that actually and I really do like that sort of thing.

24:37 Adam Because obviously you see that this version of the vampire is living in a cave, eating ferrets.

24:46 Adam And you know, very reduced circumstances and that's the bit that he takes from Dracula.

24:53 Adam Is the the thing of oh, he hasn't got any servants, so he used to be a lot more powerful than he was.

24:58 Adam You know.

24:59 Adam Or sort of and.

25:01 Adam Yeah, I just but again.

25:02 Adam That's a lovely sort of it's a weird, lovely little insight because when you think about it, it's like the whole there is that element with Dracula where you're sort of like, oh, well, it's meant to be this sort of powerful figure or whatever like that.

25:12 Adam But actually, yeah, by the time that he's Dracula in the book.

25:17 Adam It's it's clearly reduced circumstances.

25:20 Lee Yeah.

25:20 Adam Mostly on the basis that let's face it, who in the who in their fucking right mind who's local is going to go and work there.

25:26 Adam He's going to hang around the place or anything, you know.

25:29 Chris Yeah.

25:31 Adam They leave it off maps at that point.

25:33 Adam You know what I mean?

25:35 Lee one of the other things I loved about this, that really stood out to me this and it's such a minor thing, but I loved it. The transitions from them behind the camera to seeing the camera where they kept pulling in so they changed it to sepia and then kind of wrote the edges of the screen in to create that kind of lens effect.

25:47 Adam Yeah, when it's the the focus, yeah.

25:49 Lee Yeah.

25:50 Lee I loved that, it was just it was such a nice little touch to go from behind the camera to in front of the camera, but it was just such a nice way of of going from one to the other.

25:57 Lee I just thought it was excellent, it really, really stood out.

26:00 Adam And I'm not sure, I mean, I don't know if the goggles thing was actually something that was a necessary part of equipment.

26:04 Chris Yeah.

26:04 Adam while filming.

26:07 Chris Yeah.

26:08 Chris So what were they?

26:09 Adam just adds a very mad scientist.

26:11 Chris It does.

26:12 Lee Yeah everybody on set wearing white coats like lab coats all the time as well.

26:18 Adam Mind you, that was quite because it was like a technician thing, it used to be the same with recording studios, like producers would be in in white coats and things like that because it was like considered, you know, it's a technical, it's a laboratory essentially.

26:31 Adam And especially I suppose at that point where it was like, yeah, the camera's the lights are probably likely to explode and blow your face off, you know, things hadn't been quite as refined at that point, you know.

26:40 Adam But the thing I the weirdest thing was is that the director of this.

26:43 Adam Because I was like, oh, he must have done other stuff.

26:47 Adam And it's E. Elias Merige.

26:52 Adam Now he did a serial killer film that I'm only aware of because Clint Mansel did the soundtrack.

26:57 Lee

26:58 Adam which is called Suspect Zero.

27:01 Adam And but I was like, which interesting enough is it's a serial killer bumping off other serial killers, but it's pre-Dexter.

27:12 Lee Okay.

27:13 Adam And there is a thing about someone taking bodies around in a fridge.

27:17 Adam Like a refrigerated van, you know, so it was all very sort of thinking about.

27:20 Adam It was very pre-Dexter, but very similar.

27:24 Adam

27:24 Adam But in 1998, he did the film The Begotten.

27:26 Adam Now I don't know if you're aware of The Begotten, but it is.

27:30 Lee No.

27:31 Adam basically, and and reading about it, he was an ex because he was like he's a theater director.

27:35 Adam And that's what he's mostly gone back to doing.

27:38 Adam But The Begotten is basically, Marilyn Manson then got him to direct two videos.

27:44 Adam That's the kind of thing that The Begotten is.

27:47 Adam The Begotten is like you know the Clive Barker shorts, the Forbidden and the black and white student ones that he did.

27:59 Lee Yes.

28:00 Adam It's kind of in that vein.

28:01 Adam It's like this grainy, silent art film, really gory, but really stylized and weird and like God shits out a man and then slips his throat.

28:14 Adam I mean it's fucking mental.

28:15 Adam And it is very much it's in that sort of same vein of yes, I would watch it late at night, but around but I'm also watching Tetsuo and a razor head.

28:25 Adam So it was you know, but yeah, and and just to have sort of I there was no way on fucking earth I'd have put the two together.

28:33 Adam Because this you know, this for want of a better phrase, this is classy, the other the other one's classy, but it's arty classy.

28:44 Adam And fucking like I say, it's very it's very art house.

28:49 Adam It's very grim.

28:50 Adam It's one of those things that you you could sort of it's definitely not something that you can just.

28:55 Adam Pass by, it's sort of looks pretty sort of, you know, it's pretty raw, pretty weird and strange and everything.

29:01 Adam And I'm pretty sure it came out on like, you know, it was that label, was it Redemption or whatever like that.

29:09 Lee Oh, yeah, I remember those.

29:10 Adam Yeah, I think it came.

29:11 Adam I'm sure it came out on like that back in but it's like it's unavailable in most places.

29:15 Adam It's on YouTube.

29:17 Adam But it is like utterly, utterly unlike this in as many ways as you can be, you know, but it's but it was just a weird thing to sort of like find it's like finding you it was like finding sort of like, no, there's no there's no connection here.

30:02 Adam But it's like, hang on, the person who's done the downward spirals just released snuffbox.

30:06 Lee

30:07 Adam You know, or like Bat Barry's last album or something like that.

30:08 Adam You know, it's just like, what?

30:10 Adam How did we get I don't know.

30:12 Adam But.

30:13 Chris Yeah.

30:13 Lee We need to hear.

30:14 Lee Speaking of.

30:14 Lee Actually, the music stood out in this as well.

30:16 Lee For it was such a subtle.

30:18 Adam

30:18 Lee kind of underlying.

30:20 Adam Yeah.

30:21 Lee It was just wonderful.

30:22 Lee Really, really.

30:23 Adam Yeah, Dan Jones, I think is the composer on this.

30:25 Adam It's really good.

30:26 Adam Actually, the original title of the film was Burnt to Light, because that's how you.

30:32 Adam That's essentially how like filming works.

30:35 Chris Yeah.

30:36 Adam is burnt to light.

30:37 Chris Also, vampires are.

30:38 Adam Burnt by light.

30:39 Adam And it's it's the title of the opening, it's like the opening title music on the soundtrack.

30:45 Adam is called burnt to light as well.

30:46 Adam So he obviously took took that from there.

30:49 Adam But yeah, so that was the original.

30:50 Adam working title of it.

30:51 Adam I think it was because I'm sure I read somewhere that someone was taking the piss and said it was like, yeah, but what's burn head to light.

30:58 Adam And they were like, all right.

31:00 Adam We're going to have to change that if someone's going to.

31:02 Adam be stupid about it.

31:03 Adam We'll change it.

31:05 Adam One last note and especially again, feels like a lot of oddball people have been involved and everything else like that.

31:12 Adam This is the first film that Nicholas Cage produced.

31:16 Lee Oh, yeah, I saw that.

31:17 Lee Come up at the beginning, I was I was like, what the hell.

31:18 Lee But yeah.

31:20 Adam Yeah.

31:20 Lee But having watched it, I'm like, oh yeah, of course he did.

31:24 Lee Like it's a perfect sense when someone tells you it.

31:29 Adam Well, not only that, but also the sort of like, what the a strange man who's really who really wants to give you a great performance.

31:35 Lee Yeah.

31:36 Adam What what first drew you to the project, Nicholas Cage?

31:43 Lee but yeah, I'm so glad that we did this because it is it's one of those films I watched, loved, and we've mentioned it so many times.

31:54 Lee But I just never go back and rewatch it, and then when I did, I was like, oh, you're an idiot, how is this sat on the shelf for so long and not come out for, you know, at least every couple of years.

32:04 Lee It's it will be from now on.

32:05 Lee Without a doubt.

32:05 Adam No, I was much the same, much the same.

32:08 Chris It does feel like you need to watch Nosferatu first.

32:12 Chris Like at least once.

32:13 Chris You know.

32:14 Chris But also it seems like potentially you could do both.

32:16 Adam You know what the.

32:17 Adam Yeah.

32:19 Adam But I think that weirdly enough, though, we did it as although it's like the the link with this with late night and the devil and this was behind the scenes.

32:30 Adam I think it's actually also oh, it's it's kind of like fake history.

32:36 Lee Yeah.

32:37 Adam Or or alternate cool history or something like that.

32:39 Adam Where it's like, well, here's what here's the real thing, but what if it was a vampire, that'd be.

32:45 Chris Yeah.

32:45 Adam Wouldn't it.

32:46 Adam And similarly, you know, it's like.

32:48 Adam Well, here's here's the Johnny Carson show, but what if he did actually get someone out who's possessed, you know.

32:54 Chris And and really.

32:55 Chris Watching Nosferatu, you know, you could believe that they did use a real vampire.

33:00 Chris It certainly you know, it's strange enough.

33:02 Adam I think it was one of those things like there was a lot of myths around it.

33:06 Adam Because he's called Max Schreck as well, which is like fear in German.

33:10 Adam So loads of people just thought it was a pseudonym.

33:12 Chris Yeah.

33:13 Adam And so again, there were like, well, I I say rumors, I'm going to say playground rumors.

33:18 Lee Yeah.

33:19 Adam Because that's what it feels like.

33:20 Adam But he's a real vampire, they got a real vampire, he played a real vampire.

33:25 Adam He got played the vampire in that it was my mate telling me that.

33:28 Adam And he's and he's dead's got a pouch, but he only takes it out of weekends.

33:31 Adam And after dark.

33:32 Lee Yeah.

33:33 Lee I think I'm sure I heard somewhere, and again, it could have just been a similar rumor.

33:37 Lee Cuz I I can't for the life of me remember where, but I'm sure I heard something saying that Max Shrek, yeah, did only turn up on set for his, you know, didn't hang out with the crew and do that stuff, and he did just turn up and shoot his scenes and then disappeared.

33:49 Lee But again, that might be.

33:50 Lee Me misremembering it or somebody passing on false information or somebody confusing this film with what actually.

33:53 Chris Oh, yeah.

33:53 Chris Yeah.

33:54 Chris Yeah, that could exist.

33:55 Adam Well, cuz not that, but also I suppose there's there's the there's the element of it if if someone's having like a load of make up put on, especially like in the early days of that sort of thing, it probably was most of the time it was, right, you go off to the makeup and have your nose redone and have your have your nails redone because they've fallen out.

34:10 Adam And, you know, so he's probably spending most of his time in makeup, while everyone else is sitting around in the middle of stuff being changed.

34:14 Adam And things like that, so it's very possible that he never saw anyone.

34:17 Adam because the poor bugger spent most of his time having his like mask done and everything.

34:20 Lee I mean, he is touched up on.

34:21 Adam Filthy swine.

34:23 Lee

34:24 Lee Yeah, so I mean, 100% recommend this film.

34:27 Lee I just I yeah, I thoroughly enjoyed it more than I thought I was going to and I was very much looking forward to seeing it again.

34:34 Lee So.

34:35 Lee Yeah, this is a this is a great way to start our Halloween viewing really this year.

34:39 Adam

34:41 Lee So on that note, we're going to be back in a Fortnight's time.

34:44 Lee We're going to do something a bit different.

34:47 Lee we have decided that as Chris is no longer being welcomed to horror, being 250 plus movies in by this point, including stuff he watched for.

34:57 Chris That's that's quite a few, isn't it?

34:59 Lee That's yeah, that's a considerable amount.

35:01 Lee

35:02 Lee So we thought it would be nice, rather than covering a film, to sit down with Chris and just, yeah.

35:08 Lee Give him a chance to do us a bit of a retrospective, what of his highlights been of the last 200 episodes, what subgenres he's discovered, what things he's found that he really liked, what he doesn't like.

35:22 Lee So we're just going to kind of sit down and just have a general horror discussion, yeah, about everything that Chris has learned.

35:27 Lee There will be a test.

35:29 Lee It will go on your permanent record.

35:32 Adam And and we reserve the right that you may sit on the council but you are not granted the the position of.

35:40 Chris So.

35:40 Adam So just just just getting that out there quick.

35:43 Adam Because that went well for the last people who said that.

35:46 Adam That went really fucking well for them, you know.

35:51 Lee Yeah, that sounds great.

35:53 Lee Yeah.

35:54 Lee Yeah.

35:54 Lee Yeah.

35:54 Chris We don't need to worry about consistency or integrity.

35:56 Lee No.

35:56 Chris Or any of those.

35:58 Lee Don't.

35:58 Adam I.

35:59 Lee Don't.

35:59 Lee Don't.

36:00 Lee So when this episode comes out, there's going to be about a week or so before we record again.

36:04 Lee so if anyone has any questions that they'd like to send in for Chris, please obviously send them to our email [email protected].

36:13 Lee or contact us on our social, DM us on there and ask Chris any questions you would like to ask him or get his opinions on.

36:22 Lee yeah, and we will be back in a Fortnight's time for that.

36:24 Lee Thanks very much for listening.

36:26 Lee Good night.

36:27 Chris Good night.

36:28 Adam Naty night.