Donnie Darko

0:22 Lee Good evening and welcome to Horror.

0:24 Lee I'm Lee.

0:25 Chris I'm Chris.

0:26 Adam I'm Adam.

0:27 Lee And we are here this evening for the second part of our, what month are we doing? There's a theme to this.

0:36 Chris I think This must be Halloween, isn't it?

0:40 Lee We're a horror podcast, it's always Halloween.

0:43 Chris Well,

0:45 Chris but I thought we we did Donnie Darko in between our theme, but did I go, no, I was

0:50 Chris maybe it could be, it could be sci-fi still, I guess.

0:53 Adam I think it was just we we just We think it was sci-fi.

0:55 Chris But yeah, yeah, it's funny, I totally do not think of it as a sci-fi film, but it really is.

0:01 Lee Yeah.

0:01 Chris Which is kind of weird.

0:02 Lee Adam clearly did when he thought of putting this together.

0:06 Lee But yeah, so we are here for the 2001 movie Donnie Darko.

0:11 Lee a film I'm guessing we've all seen multiple times before.

0:16 Lee and there will be spoilers, there will be swearing, if you haven't seen this film,

0:24 Lee I don't know if we're gonna be able

0:25 Chris I was I was gonna say I was gonna say yeah, what happens right, exactly, that's the thing.

0:28 Chris Is it possible to spoil?

0:32 Chris I'm hoping Adam's gonna fully explain it to us because I feel like I'm just one step behind on this one.

0:38 Chris Like, and I love everything about it, there you go, said it straight out.

0:41 Chris I don't think I've hidden that before, but, but still, yeah.

0:46 Chris I I I still feel like is it 'cause it's time travel, then that that could be a complete spoiler.

0:52 Adam Except it kind of tells you that at the start.

0:55 Lee Yeah.

0:56 Adam And it's sort of

0:58 Adam I I to be honest, I think all the hints you can get going into this, this isn't one where you're like,

0:04 Adam you know, it's it's best to go in a bit prepared at least.

0:07 Chris That's so I'm trying to remember though, and I think Lee, I totally cut you off probably while you're explaining.

0:13 Lee No, no, it's fine.

0:14 Lee That was all I was going into really.

0:16 Chris But it's is I find this one of the harder films having when you know what happens to remember what I was thinking exactly the first time I watched it.

0:26 Lee Yeah.

0:27 Chris Because I almost still feel like, as you said, still trying to figure it out and it's like, well, I know way more about it having watched it quite a few times now.

0:34 Chris And yeah, still it it's funny how it's somewhat somewhat difficult to be sure.

0:41 Lee I I think I've seen it three times, I think I watched it the first time and I got to the end and thought I had it.

0:48 Lee And then when I watched it the second time, I was like, that's nothing like I remember.

0:52 Lee Yeah. And then I tried it again the third time,

0:58 Lee yeah, and thinking right, well, this time I'm gonna really focus in and I'm really gonna nail it.

0:02 Lee yeah, and again I came away thinking, yeah, I I still don't think so.

0:09 Lee So I'm gonna be absolutely honest, I have not watched it this time for the podcast.

0:14 Chris Oh, no, we boy.

0:15 Lee Because I I made a conscious decision because

0:18 Lee every time I've watched it the first time and I loved it, and every time I've watched it subsequently, I've liked it a little bit less.

0:26 Lee and I know that I'm generally the contrarian on this and you both come in and go, what a great movie that is, and I go, fuck that.

0:34 Lee So, I've decided not to watch it and go off of my fairly remembrance.

0:39 Chris Yeah, no, that's that's a fair fair idea, I would say.

0:43 Chris It'd be interesting to see, yeah, Adam's take on it then and see what we all end up with.

0:48 Chris But, so I think this might be my fourth time, I watched it, I'm fairly certain I watched it soon after it came out.

0:56 Chris I didn't watch it in the cinema,

0:01 Chris But I remember being hooked from the start when

0:05 Chris I I I was trying to work out, you know, watching it with trying to be slightly more critical on this viewing and figure out exactly what I think and why.

0:12 Chris But it's it's something about it's very mundane and yet really surreal

0:18 Lee Yeah.

0:19 Chris all the way through and that just gripped me from the start, the way you see him wake up and he's like with his his got bite and he's on a sort of large heel mountain and like what's going on.

0:30 Chris And then the way the music then transitions and it becomes quite dreamlike and that you don't hear sounds as much and then you just sort of see his dad blowing the the leaf blower, his sister and his mum just reading, reading.

0:43 Lee Oh, Pet Sematary.

0:45 Chris What do we say, how do we refer to Stephen King now, the author that wrote Pet Sematary.

0:50 Lee Yeah.

0:53 Chris and then it's like, oh, that's interesting references and you like I had no idea what it was about, you know, you've heard the name and you're like,

0:59 Chris I don't know, and what is going on and why is this all so mundane when something weird has happened, because what's he doing, you know, up the on his bike.

0:04 Chris And then you think it's all about his difficulties with mental illness.

0:12 Chris So it's like I just yeah, the first time through, no idea really where it was going to go, how horror based it was going to be, or yeah, and I I think that's it, I was just totally,

0:24 Chris yeah, this has really got me and and just that whole aesthetic throughout I find fascinating.

0:29 Lee Oh it it is an absolutely beautiful movie.

0:32 Lee And I I I enjoy so many things about it, I say, which is kind of why I didn't want to mar it for myself.

0:39 Lee Yeah, because yeah, it it's just as you say, it's got that really strange, like almost '80s, I know it's based in the '80s, but it's got that almost '80s feel where it's like, oh, we don't have to explain everything, which they don't do anymore.

0:52 Lee Everything gets overexplained and, you know,

0:57 Lee Whereas with this, it just kind of tells you the story.

0:01 Lee Yeah, that was the first time so I didn't see this at the cinema, I hired it on VHS.

0:06 Lee Okay. when it first came out.

0:08 Lee because it it was before I'd been on the internet, but I had a friend who was getting into the internet, and I spoke to him on the phone, and I was like, oh, what you been doing?

0:16 Lee And he said, oh, I watched Donnie Darko, so I've just spent the last two days on the internet trying to find out what the film was about.

0:24 Lee I was like, how did you watch a film and not understand it?

0:27 Lee And he was like, oh, well, once you've seen it, you'll totally get it.

0:31 Lee So I I went and hired it that weekend.

0:34 Lee yeah, and totally knew exactly what he was on about.

0:37 Lee But yeah, so I I came away thoroughly enjoying it and yeah, and not really feeling that I was missing out by not 100% getting.

0:47 Chris That's it.

0:50 Chris Yeah, yeah, you just take so much from it.

0:55 Chris Really like about I guess elements of being a teenager growing up.

0:01 Chris The difficulties of kind of trusting different people and authority, like you'll being told this.

0:06 Chris But, you know, he's clever and so he's questioning and it's like it's interesting how some of the adults don't like that.

0:11 Chris and don't accept it, whereas some others are supporting him.

0:16 Chris yeah, but then there's there's this sort of a it's almost a I don't know, like a choir, it's not always quiet, sometimes they scream, but there's a desperation to almost everybody, it's like things are just not quite great for everybody.

0:30 Lee Everybody's a breaking point and you don't know why or if it's for the same reason.

0:39 Lee Yeah, so it's it's just carries that it is it's that tension, isn't it, all the way through.

0:45 Lee Yeah, that constantly puts you off kilter and does leave you just going, I don't know why any of this is happening.

0:52 Lee Yeah.

0:54 Adam See, the question I would ask is, 'cause I I I watched the theatrical version.

0:01 Chris So I only learned that.

0:03 Chris you know, just today in fact.

0:04 Adam Yeah.

0:08 Adam And the director's cut, it's it's a weird thing, 'cause I watched the theatrical version and I was like, have I seen the director's cut, have I not?

0:18 Adam but the one of the main things they do in the director's cut is they show you bits of the philosophy of time travel book.

0:27 Chris

0:28 Adam So, so the harder sci-fi end of it comes out more.

0:33 Adam And I was convinced, I'm like, maybe I have seen the director's cut.

0:36 Adam And then I remembered, it was an extra on the original DVD.

0:41 Chris Okay.

0:43 Adam Which they then put into So you saw the scenes in the director's cut.

0:46 Chris Yeah.

0:47 Chris Oh, that's interesting.

0:48 Chris So, so Lee was saying that he didn't actually watch it for for this one I should just say Adam had to go away briefly and might that bit.

0:58 Chris but yeah, so and he didn't want to watch it because he almost feels like the more details he gets, the slightly worse it gets every time.

0:05 Lee Yeah, the more I watch it, the less I enjoy the film.

0:07 Lee And I I when I came away the first time, I loved it, so I never want to get to a point where I don't like it.

0:12 Chris Absolutely, yeah.

0:14 Chris But that's interesting, seeing those details in trying to explain more about the physics of time travel, I guess, then yeah, that could potentially take away more.

0:26 Adam That was something I forgot to do.

0:28 Adam That was something I forgot to do is I was going to not in a I think you'll find that he was wearing a wristwatch that would only have been available in 1989 and this is set in 1988.

0:39 Adam So not wishing to be one of those people, but I was I was going to look up and I just totally forgot.

0:47 Adam I was going to look up the publication date of a brief history of time.

0:51 Chris yeah.

0:52 Adam The science teachers got that when he's talking to him about time travel.

0:56 Adam And it was like and in my head, I was like,

0:01 Adam that feels like it was but I presume it was something where the ball rolled and it was more prevalent in the '90s.

0:07 Lee Yeah, but it had already been out.

0:08 Adam But it was already published, you know, I don't think they'd make an error like that in this anyway.

0:15 Chris I could imagine a book like that might have taken a little while to get some traction.

0:19 Lee Yeah.

0:20 Adam It's not an instant, it's not an instant obvious bestseller, is it?

0:23 Adam But but it was like a sort of pop science phenomenon for a while in the '90s, certainly, a lot of people had read it then.

0:33 Adam And well, a lot of people had bought it then.

0:36 Lee Yes, I I I I have a copy, I like everybody else who read the first two chapters.

0:44 Adam But I think that yeah, but like I sort of got the gist you're saying that because

0:51 Adam it is a it is a odd world, well, not it's not an odd world, it's a horrible world.

0:55 Chris It's a mad world.

0:56 Adam Oh, thank you.

0:57 Adam It's but it's a horribly true sort of feeling world.

0:03 Adam But like you say, where everyone just seems a bit just on the verge of something.

0:11 Chris Yeah.

0:11 Adam Everyone's just from the verge collapse or snapping or, you know.

0:18 Adam And which which feels oddly prescient, you know, it's

0:22 Lee I I think that's one of the things as well that it's the relationships in this that I do find draw me in too much.

0:30 Lee You know, his relationship with his sister and with his like it all feels.

0:33 Chris Feels very real and yeah.

0:35 Chris Yeah, really good.

0:37 Chris And it was funny, so yeah, the first time I watched it, I had no idea that they were actually brother and sister.

0:40 Chris And then when I when I learned that, I was like, oh, did that actually that could have helped.

0:44 Lee No.

0:44 Chris You know, because they really do work well together.

0:47 Chris But all the cast seem to work really well together.

0:50 Adam I I think it's a stroke of fucking genius and fortunate that they're both really good actors.

0:56 Chris Yeah.

0:57 Adam But equally it's a stroke of genius, 'cause there is just that short hand there, like that bickering at the table.

0:03 Adam And it's like, you just made a prick of yourself, smile.

0:09 Adam You know, is frighteningly, frighteningly real.

0:13 Chris I've gotta say, after watching this again and now having older children, I do see some some similarities with me and the father more than I did the last time I watched this.

0:25 Adam I think I think oddly enough, that's kind of a positive thing because I think the dad's all right.

0:30 Chris He's he's like he's all right.

0:32 Adam You know what I mean?

0:32 Chris He doesn't he's breaking in a kind of I'm trying to just let things go a bit and, you know, just not get too caught up all the time.

0:41 Adam Yeah, he he he seems sort of all right, but not not a great parent.

0:48 Chris No, he's got he's got quite a less a fair, having him as your dad.

0:51 Chris Whereas like, oh, he is going to burst out laughing at this point when I, you know.

0:58 Adam It's quite quite a dramatic sort of moment to be in a

0:01 Adam called in by your head teacher.

0:05 Adam And

0:07 Chris That is that is funny.

0:09 Adam So so yeah, don't be too harsh on yourself.

0:11 Chris I think.

0:12 Adam Yeah.

0:13 Adam I mean, his his politics are all over the shop and he does play golf with Nazis, but, you know,

0:18 Chris Aside from that, yeah.

0:20 Adam Aside from that.

0:22 Lee Yeah.

0:22 Adam And that's that's

0:23 Chris Oh, sorry.

0:24 Lee Oh, sorry.

0:26 Adam No, I was going to say because that's something that we'll we may come to because it isn't it's weird because it's not a positive reset that he does entirely.

0:40 Adam Do you know what I mean?

0:41 Adam In terms of

0:41 Chris Yeah.

0:42 Chris Yeah.

0:43 Adam The world, you know, yes, he saves Gretchen's life, he saves Frank's life, he probably saves Miss Pomroy's job.

0:52 Adam because he doesn't go on a vandalism spree that eventually gets her the push because of the book.

0:58 Lee Because she's in a in every single time.

0:02 Adam And and she's the reason that we all saw it, because basically she said, she read the script and she was the one who said, my production company will put X amount in this, so it can get a cinema release and be out there.

0:13 Chris Nice.

0:14 Chris Oh, okay.

0:15 Adam in return for a role in there.

0:18 Chris Fair play, yeah. Well, and it's a good role. Yeah.

0:20 Lee Yeah.

0:21 Lee She does do fantastic, as she always does, I mean.

0:24 Adam I think I think the weirdest one was having not seen it for so long and then looking like going through the cast list and like Seth Rogan's in there.

0:36 Chris Yeah, yeah.

0:37 Adam And

0:37 Chris That is a funny funny role for him after having now seen what he typically does.

0:40 Adam I think it's a perfect role for him, it's just I assume that's just him at school.

0:44 Chris Yeah, it could.

0:47 Adam Yeah.

0:48 Lee And say saying about funny casting though, you know, it's the same with Patrick Swayze.

0:59 Chris Absolutely, yeah.

0:01 Lee Again, he was one of those people, I don't know a lot about him, his films aren't generally the type of thing that I'd watch.

0:05 Lee But I very much had this

0:07 Lee takes himself extremely seriously.

0:10 Chris Likes being a heartthrob kind of.

0:12 Lee Yeah.

0:12 Lee And I think and I think coming to this film not knowing where it was going and his character in this, I was like, oh, it's just a bit of a vanity thing and I kind of

0:19 Lee Yeah, and then when you twist, I was like, oh, my respect just went through the roof.

0:22 Chris Absolutely, yeah.

0:25 Chris I I think that's it, I I respected everyone that was in this film.

0:28 Chris And yeah, and particularly that, but it is it is interesting how in a sense, none of them appear as great characters because of the world that they're in.

0:38 Lee Yeah.

0:39 Chris And it's like, but they all just play it so well, you just yeah, it's like.

0:43 Chris I mean, the way Jake Gyllenhaal, plays a a, you know, teenager with mental illness, like for me, he just captured it so well.

0:52 Chris Where it's like he is he's not, you know, he's on the edge and it's like which way is it going.

0:59 Chris And yeah, I just thought he really did.

0:02 Lee But he never kind of overplays it.

0:05 Lee Like he's it's very as you say, it all feels very true to life and very very real.

0:11 Lee And I I mean, I'm so glad to see that this film did, you know, launch him into the stratosphere and obviously he went on to do massive stuff and has knocked it out the park every time.

0:23 Lee but yeah, I think this was a this was a perfect place for him to start because he he just nailed it really.

0:30 Chris Yeah, and I think it's it's funny, in terms like you say, you don't have to fully understand it really.

0:35 Chris There's so many gems to take away from it that it's like that's all enough, you don't really need to necessarily feel like you've fully understood.

0:44 Chris It's and I and I don't think I don't think it is possible because with a lot of sci-fi, I think like we said last week, you can start picking holes in a lot of it and it's like it doesn't actually make sense because it can't really exist, most sci-fi is not possible.

0:58 Chris So you've already kind of decided to make a film that is unlikely to be fully explained if you try to.

0:05 Chris so ignoring that, then yeah, there's just there is so much.

0:09 Chris I I mean, even something like the what was it? The the language Cador.

0:17 Chris Like even just that stuck in my head when I saw that saying, I was like, I so funny, I've never thought of the English language as being not having nice sounding phrases.

0:28 Chris And it's like it's kind of funny how that does because you think Cellador sounds rubbish.

0:35 Chris He's like, no, actually the sound of it is beautiful.

0:36 Adam Oddly enough, it reminded me there's obviously, RIP Michael Gambon, but it reminds me of a bit from The Singing Detective.

0:44 Adam And there's a bit because he plays a writer in that, and at one very towards the end of it, he says to someone, do you know what the most beautiful word in the English language is?

0:54 Adam Okay. And I think they reply is it rose, and he says, no, it's elbow.

0:01 Chris Oh.

0:01 Adam Just because of how it flows, how it looks written down.

0:05 Chris But you start off, you know, as soon as you hear that, it's hard to not think of the thing, and so it's like, you know, that's your experience of it.

0:12 Chris But yeah, if you just view the phonetics of it, it's it's completely different.

0:15 Adam And the actual just physical symbols that make that, you know, it's sort of,

0:21 Adam Yeah.

0:22 Adam It's but no, there's a lot of

0:24 Adam because he I'll I'll give you the a brief history of of time travel.

0:30 Adam is that basically, 'cause I don't think it comes up, it's all of this is what was explained in the book, so it turns up in the in in the excerpts of the book that they show you.

0:41 Adam The book doesn't exist, obviously, the time travel book.

0:46 Adam but basically, so Donnie's what's called basically, it all takes place in what's called a tangent universe.

0:54 Adam Which is a bit of the universe that's gone awry.

0:58 Adam And and until it gets corrected almost like ground hog day.

0:04 Adam It can basically bubble and fuck up the real universe.

0:08 Adam Because it gets it's like a record getting stuck on a groove or something like that, it just doesn't eventually you just break the universe because you've got this little tangent bubble that's appeared.

0:20 Adam And and there's the possibility a lot of people think that there's a lot of people now theorize, like fans on line and stuff, theorize that this isn't Donnie's first loop.

0:31 Chris

0:33 Adam That maybe other characters like her putting seller door on the what on the blackboard, then makes him think of Roberta Sparrow's house and going through the cellar to get into the house.

0:48 Adam And it's almost like these characters sort of vaguely remember what's happened.

0:53 Adam Because at the end, Gretchen and his mom sort of sing to recognize each other.

0:58 Chris Yeah, yeah, I always.

0:01 Adam Even though she's never met him and obviously the universe has been reset, so she never meets Donnie because he's dead.

0:07 Adam And you did say spoilers and fucking swearing, didn't you?

0:10 Lee I did, yes, yes.

0:11 Adam Good, right, fine.

0:13 Adam yeah, so it's like it's almost like some characters might be trying to remembering to try and put things in line.

0:24 Adam so that Donnie can get the formula right this time and reset the universe or find out.

0:31 Adam And Donnie is what's called a living receiver, which is a being chosen to guide the artifact back to the primary universe.

0:43 Adam Now, the artifact is something that comes out from that comes out of the primary universe into the diversion universe, is usually made of metal, it's the jet engine.

0:54 Lee Yeah.

0:55 Adam So it's his job is to get that back to where it belongs, because obviously it's dropped through time and gone wrong somehow, because it's basically come back from.

1:03 Adam it drops off the plane that his mum and sister are coming home on, and yeah.

1:12 Adam So,

1:14 Adam he basically, he has to create a wormhole to send that back in time.

1:22 Adam and he has those powers, apparently.

1:25 Adam Because as a living receiver, you gain supernatural power or like enhanced strength or just basically a bit sort of superpower sort of thing.

1:33 Adam so he's able to create a portal to send it back in time and then but be under it this time so that it works.

0:03 Adam and then Frank is part of the manipulated dead, who are beings connected to the living receiver who have died within the tangent universe, they can move through time and contact the living receiver with details of future knowledge.

0:21 Adam Whereas there's also the the manipulated living, which is people who are connected to him who don't die in the tangent universe, but still have some vague memory of what's happened.

0:30 Adam But somehow, dying in that universe enables you to travel through time and warn him shit.

0:38 Lee So all of these these, you know, all of these theories have sprung up just from this movie.

0:47 Lee This isn't like a a theory that people

0:49 Adam No, this is basically this is what was in Richard Kelly's head when he wrote the book when he wrote the film rather.

0:57 Adam Yeah. And then the book has those little bits in there.

0:01 Adam And I think personally, they were probably just released on the DVD as, well, I had this backstory and maybe it didn't come out clear enough.

0:08 Adam Because he's now putting them in the director's cut.

0:11 Lee Yeah.

0:11 Adam Even though he said there wasn't his director's cut is not technically.

0:15 Adam It wasn't because the studio took it off him or something like that.

0:19 Adam He Donnie Darko as it appeared as a theatrical release was what he wanted to go out in the cinema.

0:26 Adam And I think that, yeah, so the director's cut is like, I wanted to I can put more stuff in and, you know,

0:32 Adam explain it better, have a second go almost, it's like a second draft, maybe.

0:36 Lee Yeah, but I think that's the thing, I think if you've got all that in your head and you put it all to film, and you know the backstory, you might go, oh, well, it seems obvious to me 'cause I know.

0:49 Lee But if you then release it, yeah, the whole world watches your film and go,

0:52 Lee it's brilliant.

0:53 Lee But I don't know what the fuck happened.

0:54 Lee You're like, yeah.

0:55 Lee I need to go back and fix it, well, you don't need to, it's done well.

0:57 Lee You know.

0:58 Lee You've achieved what you wanted.

0:58 Lee But yeah, a later date, you've then got that.

0:02 Lee that ability to say right, I'm gonna go back and I'm gonna re-edit it and rework it and better explain what I was trying to put together.

0:09 Chris But it's interesting, even though the film is based on that premise essentially, and you need all of that to make the film, all of that is actually not what makes the film good.

0:15 Lee No.

0:16 Chris This sort of a funny paradox almost.

0:19 Adam I think the I think the good thing is this film works in a way that I think you get certain science fiction does it really well and it's this thing of if you can make it almost magical or you know, border into the fantastical.

0:37 Adam And it makes it makes like dream logic sense as much as it did like sort of fantasy logic sense, in that you don't have to know what the mechanics of it are and what things are called.

0:49 Adam And let's face it, the theory of time travel does not actually grant you anything other than an insight into

0:52 Adam what happens in a divergent universe and why things happen in that sort of sense.

0:55 Adam But it doesn't explain like, oh, and then you summon a portal in this way and this is the physical properties of, you know, it doesn't go ment in that sense.

0:02 Adam But, you know, it's kind of like it's you can almost read it like he just wishes hard enough that he goes back in time and so and puts it right.

0:13 Lee Yeah.

0:14 Chris Yeah, he wants to choose that Yeah, yeah.

0:15 Adam He can put right what once went wrong and maybe next time his best leap will be the leap home.

0:20 Chris Good, I should

0:20 Adam And actually in the director's cut, Donnie's first line is, oh, boy, and the opening music is.

0:29 Lee Yeah.

0:34 Adam So, yeah, basically it started out as a it was a quantum leap episode that just got out of hand, because the show would finish and they were like this too good an idea to the room.

0:42 Adam So.

0:42 Lee I did love the music in this as well, it was you know, it was yeah, it was great.

0:47 Adam That's the point, that's the reason I won't watch, I didn't watch the director's cut.

0:51 Adam is because I was like, oh, I don't think I've watched the director's cut, I'll watch the director's cut.

0:56 Adam And then I found out that you don't get the killing moon at the start of it and I thought you can fuck off then.

0:02 Adam 'Cause that song's fucking amazing, they've replaced it with an excess, and I'm sorry, but a strangle wank versus one of the finest, you know, gothic pop songs that's ever been.

0:14 Adam It's yeah.

0:16 Adam But also and this this is the weird fucking thing is I didn't realize quite kind of the timeline on this.

0:22 Adam Actually time.

0:25 Adam This came out in October 2001 in America.

0:30 Adam In that America.

0:33 Adam and basically, it it's not the same on a lot of the posters, but originally the font that's used at the start of the film was used on all the posters.

0:44 Adam It was decided that that font looked somewhat Arabic, so they changed it on all the posters, but they couldn't change it on the film.

0:51 Adam And most of the pre-publicity stuff was like posters of crashed jet engines and things falling out the sky.

0:01 Adam So obviously October 2001, that don't fucking track very well.

0:06 Lee No.

0:07 Adam And so in America it it it sort of did poorly at the box office because they basically had to pull half their advertising and fuck around with it and stuff like that.

0:15 Adam And just it never got the numbers that it was going to get.

0:22 Chris That's crazy.

0:22 Adam You know, and it the only way it was going to get noticed was for the wrong reasons of loads of like some red faced prat on Fox News claiming that it was laughing at the victims of 9/11 or whatever, you know.

0:32 Adam And so but then it came out over here in 2002.

0:38 Adam And did really well in UK cinema and slowly got because of that.

0:43 Adam So it slowly got on like taken up on DVD and like more people were discovering it.

0:47 Adam So it was actually, it was like Jimmy Hendrix, basically.

0:51 Adam As it came over here and became famous and then went back to America to be famous.

0:55 Adam but

0:57 Adam the weirdest part of it is, is that obviously the cover at the end of it Mad World, the tears for fear cover.

0:03 Adam is became the UK Christmas number one, 2003.

0:09 Lee Oh, God.

0:11 Adam So, it's like just a weird sort of bubbling lifespan that this film has.

0:16 Adam through that sort of delay of almost like a year before the pickup on it that happens and stuff like that.

0:25 Adam And I have to say that was a good one 'cause that was a good year 'cause it beat.

0:28 Adam what it beat the darkness, Bow Selector's Christmas single, and and and the Pop Idol of that year.

0:41 Adam Which was the first time that had been like told to fuck off out of the charts.

0:45 Adam So.

0:46 Lee Right.

0:46 Lee Yeah.

0:47 Adam So you know, it was it was good in that sense, but yeah, that and then the weirdest moment, which is when a guy

0:53 Adam go Gary Jules is the guy who sings it and Michael Andrews just plays the piano.

0:58 Adam Does all the score for this, which is a fucking brilliant score.

0:02 Chris Yeah.

0:03 Adam Like it's so sort of just right. Yeah. And again, that's the thing that gives it that sort of fantasy fairy tail edge.

0:10 Chris Yeah.

0:10 Chris Definitely.

0:11 Adam It sort of dreamy sort of stuff as well as the dread and things like that, but yeah, so a guy went on Stars in their eyes.

0:19 Adam as Gary Jules singing Mad World, why?

0:25 Adam And then it's like the next time you're on, you have to do a different one of their songs.

0:29 Lee Oh.

0:32 Adam And yeah, so he he he went and found an album track and was never seen again.

0:38 Lee Yeah.

0:41 Adam One last one on the music though.

0:43 Adam There's a Pantera song on here, but I didn't know this, Pantera disowned their first four albums.

0:48 Chris Yeah.

0:49 Adam And and so they agreed for the song to be used, but they credited as, what is it, the green mummies or something like that, the screaming green mummies.

0:59 Chris Oh.

0:01 Adam Dead Green Mummies, that's it.

0:04 Lee Yeah, you're right, yeah. Yeah.

0:07 Lee Wow, weird.

0:08 Lee Yeah, I didn't know that either.

0:11 Lee I I know Pantera, but not terribly well.

0:16 Adam So it's definitely a Halloween film, is it a horror film?

0:19 Lee Oh, yeah, we this is what we said.

0:20 Lee I think visually, 100%.

0:24 Lee Like all the the weird sky stuff, obviously Frank is freaking.

0:31 Chris Yeah, see that's that that became such an icon from it as well.

0:35 Chris but I I I would think lots of people would think it was definitely a horror film.

0:40 Chris Maybe they wouldn't if they watched it necessarily.

0:43 Chris But the impression is absolutely that it is.

0:46 Lee Yeah.

0:48 Chris And then that's what I was saying when I when I remember thinking, I think this is a horror film and then just having no concept about and as I guess most people didn't.

0:54 Chris Where's it going to go, how far is it going to go like, is there going to be a lot of Gore?

0:59 Chris Is it like it just threw me completely as to.

0:03 Adam It's so unnable.

0:04 Chris Yeah.

0:04 Adam That's the thing with it is you just genuinely don't know.

0:07 Chris It.

0:07 Chris Like you say, you hit the dream and it's like Yeah, absolutely.

0:11 Lee it never sort of stops from there literally till the closing scene.

0:15 Chris Yeah.

0:16 Lee You still have no idea what could happen in the next 30 seconds, it's fucking mental.

0:24 Lee yeah, and that that was what I loved about it, and it did throw so many curve balls in there.

0:30 Lee just totally, you know, like we said that with the Patrick Swayze thing, like that didn't for the story to happen.

0:37 Lee That that kind of relevant to anything, but it just puts it in there just as another, you know.

0:41 Lee You think you know what's happening, but you have no idea really.

0:47 Chris Yeah.

0:50 Chris And but just going back to I was going to say, so that's the one thing that's not clear if that that appears like that gets undone.

0:56 Chris So he doesn't then get caught at that point.

0:59 Lee Yeah, possible. I never thought about that.

0:01 Chris Yeah.

0:01 Adam That's the thing, you do sort of there are certain things that don't happen for the good.

0:06 Chris But is that again, the element of the way this film is trying to be somewhat realistic in its portrayal is, yeah, you can't necessarily fix everything, that's just that's just how life is, maybe.

0:19 Chris because there was another one that we didn't mention earlier was the the girl and as usual, I've forgotten her name.

0:25 Chris And the one who likes Donnie and he realizes when he sees her book on.

0:30 Adam Treeta.

0:31 Chris Treeta, yeah.

0:34 Chris I've got the list here but there's quite a lot of people.

0:36 Adam Yeah, everyone gets a credit in this.

0:38 Chris Yeah, yeah, that's good.

0:41 Chris but yeah, and you know, and even her, just her story is like, it's sweet and upsetting.

0:46 Chris That he has been kind to her and that's made her kind of fall in love with him, but he had no concept about that.

0:53 Chris Until and then it's it's strange, it's another surreal sort of moment where he feels the need to go up to her and say it's all going to be all right.

0:00 Chris And I guess what he what he meant there is that she won't then fall in love with him and be upset that they're not together.

0:07 Adam I I think at that point, I don't think he even knows other than I'm taking action that that is going to fix something.

0:16 Chris Seems right.

0:17 Chris Yeah.

0:18 Adam It's it's very you you get the feeling that it's a very driven thing that he he is not in control of.

0:28 Chris Yes, that's it does absolutely call into question, you know, predeterminism and and so on.

0:34 Chris And yeah, but how he does feel like he is taking the correct path like morally.

0:39 Chris It's when when he laughs at the end, it's, you know, he's like, he's totally accepted and knows what he's chosen is right.

0:46 Lee Yeah.

0:47 Adam It's also it's also, I've done it.

0:49 Chris Yeah, yeah.

0:50 Adam I get that sort of almost it's like, I fucking knew I could do this.

0:55 Chris Yeah.

0:56 Lee Yeah.

0:58 Lee And again, his performance in this, like, you know, and that is you say, it's it's those bits where he gets so much across without having to say anything.

0:09 Lee It's just in mannerisms and facial expressions and he just tells a whole story just through laughing, and it's I yeah, I mean, it's a brilliant thing to see, really.

0:18 Adam I I have to say on the Jake Gyllenhaal thing though,

0:22 Adam I don't know, have either of you seen Nightcrawler?

0:25 Lee Oh, God, yes.

0:25 Lee What a fucking good film that.

0:27 Lee That's one.

0:28 Lee I think with that, I would argue we could do on the podcast.

0:32 Chris Oh, okay.

0:33 Adam I think that is kind of a horror film.

0:35 Lee It's dark, it is freaking.

0:37 Adam You know.

0:38 Adam But worth checking out, Chris, because that is because I think that's one of the ones that doesn't get as much love.

0:44 Chris I've never heard of it.

0:45 Lee No, it doesn't.

0:46 Lee It it just kind of went under the radar, I think it might have been Drew who told me about it.

0:50 Lee and said, oh, you need to check it out.

0:52 Adam He was.

0:52 Adam Yeah, he definitely Drew told me, yeah.

0:55 Lee Yeah.

0:56 Lee And like yeah, I was totally blown away by it, absolutely fantastic movie.

0:02 Chris We didn't even mention.

0:03 Adam He's not blowing it and he doesn't go back.

0:06 Lee Yeah.

0:07 Adam Not that Nightcrawler.

0:09 Chris Okay.

0:11 Chris We we didn't mention the dangers of being a a a therapist and using hypnotherapy, that's got to be a bit awkward.

0:20 Chris You know, yeah, got to stop this now.

0:23 Adam Yeah.

0:24 Chris So yeah, just I think that's it, like just there's so many scenes where Jake was just like, yeah, you're just playing this really well and it's it's such a it's a weird role in a way as serious as it is kind of ridiculous.

0:39 Lee Yeah, it's got cult movie written all like, you can see how this film picked up a cult following.

0:43 Lee Like this has got one of those, you know, in the Prince Charles every two months or whatever and it's got people who go to every screening like it it has got that very cult.

0:53 Lee Again.

0:54 Lee And like you say.

0:54 Lee You can do days of research and chatting online and theorizing about it.

0:59 Lee And it.

0:01 Chris If you want to, but you don't have to.

0:02 Lee No, you can come away and enjoy it as soon as the film finishes.

0:06 Lee Yeah, or you can mull it over for days on end afterwards.

0:11 Adam And the the cinema that they're in in you know, when they're in the cinema that that cinema every Easter screens, it's a real cinema they filmed in and they screen Donnie Darko every Easter.

0:22 Chris Excellent.

0:23 Lee God, that'd be great to go to that.

0:29 Lee right.

0:30 Lee So, yes, so definite recommend from us.

0:33 Lee yeah, absolute solid movie.

0:36 Lee As I say, I and I that's the reason I didn't go back is because every time I enjoy it a little bit less, but what I love about it, I love so much, I never want to spoil this movie for myself, which that sounds like a very strange place to come from, but that's how I feel about it.

0:51 Chris I think that makes a lot of sense.

0:53 Adam Yeah.

0:55 Lee yes, so thanks ever so much for listening everybody.

0:59 Lee go, enjoy your Halloween, we will be recording again the weekend before Halloween and we'll be doing a what we've been watching.

0:10 Lee so we will have a ton of stuff, hopefully, I know I've filled up an entire page of shit, so I'm gonna have to be really really picky about what I.

0:17 Chris Prioritize well, yeah.

0:18 Lee Yeah, otherwise we're gonna have a minute per movie or something and it's gonna be.

0:22 Lee But yes.

0:23 Lee So, have a great Halloween, go and watch all your favorite spooky shit and we will see you in a fortnight for what we've been watching.

0:29 Lee Good night.

0:30 Chris Good night.

0:31 Adam Good night.

0:37 Lee Oh, now I've lost me mouse.