The Call of Cthulhu
00:36:52
About
There’s more temporal shenanigans as we go all the way back to the 1920s, by going all the way back to 2005 for the HP Lovecraft Historical Society’s film adaptation of “The Call of Cthulhu”. A film that to describe it would bring screaming madness to the mind and blacken to opacity the very soul of man (see what we did there?). The HPLHS’s decision to make “The Call of Cthulhu” as if it were adapted at the time the story was published was a real stroke of genius, and the fact they pulled it off is remarkable. Keeping the story in its original period absolutely sells it more than a modern-day setting, some of Lovecraft’s more melodramatic dialogue sits easier as inter-titles than in actor’s mouths, and the stop-motion Cthulhu is a magnificent take on the creature. The incredible attention to period detail, and the in-camera effects achieved through model shots and other methods of the time really bring a sense of scale. It also means that the film has not dated, by way of it never being of its time in the first place. Possibly the truest adaptation of any of Lovecraft’s work. Watch (or re-watch) to avoid spoilers and join us.
Adam's research
Verbatim lifts from Adam's own words in the episode. Click a timestamp to hear him say it.
- Nature of Lovecraft's Elder Gods
Yeah. And, um, and as you were saying, Lee, really, it's his because it's it's curious because essentially it's to a greater or lesser extent science fiction, in so much as there's the, as he termed them, the elder gods, which are treated by human beings as magical creatures or gods or sort of, but are actually probably more likely to be just extraterrestrial, extradimensional beings. And, and as you were saying, Lee, really, it's his because it's it's curious because essentially it's to a greater or lesser extent science fiction, in so much as there's the, as he termed them, the elder gods, which are treated by human beings as magical creatures or gods or sort of, but are actually probably more likely to be just extraterrestrial, extradimensional beings. And their Yeah. Well, it's it's that sort of but also that that lovely sort of thing of they are beyond us. It's not it's not a sort of, uh, malicious. … Oh, absolutely. Yeah. And I think, and, because, because a lot of the, a lot of the stories are sort of people, uh, sort of explorers or, um, you know, people doing scientific investigations, anthropologists and things like that, where they look into these things where it's. Yeah, exactly, you know.
- Lovecraftian Crossovers
And, and actually, weirdly enough, I think it's one of those things that's kind of ripe to, and a lot of other mythologies have crossed over with it. There's sort of, uh, Cthulhu Mythos Sherlock Holmes. … there's you know, there's just so many different thing there um they even tied it up at one point there was a a series of what once the original version of Dr the original TV version of Doctor Who finished they had a series of books after that and that actually had um some one of the authors in there linked it up that there were creatures from Doctor Who that they then translated onto the Cthulhu gods so stuff like Uh Naliatep and were analogous to other creatures and things.
- Lovecraft's Atheism and Mythology View
along with, along with his, you know, along with his clear dodgy politics and uh essential racism, you know, he was, um, uh, but I I think he was actually, as a person, he was fairly sort of, atheistic. You know, it was like, well, there's nothing, so, you know, he was. Yeah, he was he was basically sort of, you know, the this I've created this mythology if you want to run with it or whatever like that, but it wasn't, you know, it wasn't sort of something he subscribed to. He was very much. Yeah, well, it was yeah, it was very much, no, this is this is the product of my imagination.
- HPLHS Formation & Early Projects
You know, but I think, but I think, um, because funny enough, you're saying about the role playing game, that's how the HP Lovecraft Historical Society formed is originally they were, they formed a live action role playing, uh, version of the Call of Cthulhu RPG called Cthulhu Lives. And it was, uh, Andrew Lehman, Sean Braney and Phil Bell, who sort of formed the society, um, and basically, yeah, it started off that they were larping. And then they started doing a fanzine called Strange Eons and because of that, which was just sort of articles and HP Lovecraft and sort of analysis and things like that. And because of that, they then got such a a sort of build up of membership, um, they began producing their own films, and the first thing they did was called Shoggoth on the Roof. Which is a spoof documentary of, um, a supposed 1970s production of a musical, which was a a Lovecraft version of Fiddler on the Roof. And then, so, and then they they, along with that, they did an original cast recording for the of of it. Um, so you could buy the Shoggoth on the Roof, like the the album, uh, and then after that they did, they did a Christmas album, a very scary solstice. Which is like Lovecraft Carols. And then, and this is this is also like in the 90s, I think they they originally formed in about 87 or like the society officially sort of became together in 87.
- Call of Cthulhu Film Production
And then they thought, well, we'll make Call of Cthulhu because the original story is from uh, published in 1928, I think it was written in 20, uh, 1926, but it was published in Weird Tales magazine, which published a lot of Lovecraft's work. And, um, in 1928, and so they were like, well, we'll make it as if it was a film made in 1928, uh, as we say. And, it's strange that we've done it, it was especially because we did just did House of the Devil, and it's kind of strange that there's, um, you know, we've done a film that was like, right, we want this to look like it was made in 19, uh, like the early 80s. And really stuck to that and everything. And they've done a similar sort of thing, they wanted to make this look like it basically, I think their concept was if someone had bought the rights to the film there and then and made the film the same year that the story came out. So it was like, yeah, they just, um, um, and, you know, so obviously, yeah, it's a silent film. And they've really, I think it's really it's really weird coming back to it because now realizing that it's nearly it's over 20 years old. Mmm. And because of that because they've done it as it's not aged in any way. It still looks fantastic, but it also is because they've done they did such a brilliant job of evoking that sort of 30s look. And when and, you know, it took a long time. I think it was like the best part of two years putting it together. And, you know, and sort of building lots of sort of false perspective tricks and things like that to do like the effects of the city, like the the they on the island. And, and it's all sort of, yeah, they they spent a lot of, um, it's a lot of time and effort to make it it sounds bizarre, but you know, to to make it as close as possible. In as close as possible a way to how it could have been made. They don't cheat it. And everything, and then obviously you're all, yeah, and you get them. Then you get a magnificent stop motion sequence of Cthulhu, which is just, yeah, and done sparingly as well. Which I think is again a strength to it.
- Lovecraft's Short Stories & Adaptations
Because essentially Lovecraft only did sort of short stories and in fact, there's a number of adaptions, what's his name, Stewart Gordon did a lot of adaptions of Lovecraft. And there's a lot of adaptions out there where you're like, that is literally a page and a half. It's a bit like the same you get the same thing with Edgar Allan Poe. You know, where it's like, the Pit and the Pendulum as a story versus the Pit and the Pendulum as the film. It's like, right, you have put a lot in here. And still called it the Pit and the Pendulum. And similarly, there's a lot with the Lovecraft stuff, I mean, it's like even Reanimator follows the story, like of of the actual short story Herbert West Reanimator. The film Reanimator kind of follows that story reasonably closely, but it is updated, it is set in the present day and there's a lot more nudity and gore than probably is in in the story. You know, they sort of. So this this feels like this is probably one of the closest. If not the closest Lovecraft adaptation I've seen.
- Fidelity of Lovecraft Adaptations (Color Out of Space)
That is an adaption of HP Lovecraft. And actually, one of the smartest things I ever saw is that I've got a German version of that that, because this has sent me scuttling back to my box of like all the Lovecraft adaptions I bought in the early 2000s. And, um, yeah, I've got a German version of The Color Out of Space, and the smart trick they do with that is it's in black and white. So, you don't have to try and create the color that is driving people mad because it's a totally new color. Yeah. But as it's filmed in black and white, we can't see that color, so it's, you know, it's there's people do the and yeah, like you say, Dagon is, I think, one of the more faithful. Uh adaptations of the stories because a lot a lot of them they sort of spin out from, you know, it'll be literally we'll take the idea or we'll take this and that. Whereas I think, and I mean obviously they are. An HP Lovecraft appreciation society. You know, they are. Yeah. So their love is going to be in there, but I think this is one of the most adherent to the story of any that I've seen. Particularly because they've not only have they made the decision to make it period, but they've actually made the decision to make the film, like the actual concept of the film is the period as well. Yeah. So it's not just, oh, because a lot of the, I mean, Stewart Gordon ones are always modern day, um, when he does them. He never does them sort of as historical. Apart from, no, even, um, Dreams in the Witch House, the, um, Masters of Horror episode he did, I think, is present day as well, isn't it?
- Lovecraft Story Given Poe Title
I can't remember what it's but there's there's an IP film that is basically a Lovecraft film but they gave it a Poe title, isn't there? Haunted Palace, that's it. Yeah. So, but but he's actually a Lovecraft story, but they just gave it an Edgar Allen Poe title.
- Lovecraft Ghostwriting for Houdini
Um, and it was, um, Lovecraft stories that he'd written. But under assumed names, and there were a couple in there that were actually published as Houdini stories. So he was ghost writing for Houdini, and I think Houdini was sort of like basically was like, I want to do something in Egypt. Knock it up for us and so he was doing that, so he was, you know, as a writer for hire he was also doing that sort of thing, you know.
- The Fictional Nature of the Necronomicon
And and actually the Necronomicon. … Oh, so many things. And again, I have seen, you know, I've been on, uh, sort of, you know, I've been on things online and stuff like that that are treating the Necronomicon that it is an actual book. You know, there are people it's it's sort of it's weird that it's sort of got tangled up so much in terms of mythology. That it's it's people who are saying, you know, that, oh no, Lovecraft wrote some stories, but he actually owned this thing called the Necronomicon. And and it's like, no, no, we're Jesus Christ, lads, we're getting really confused now. You know, he made up the book as well, it wasn't that he read the book and then decided, oh, that'd be a good idea for a series of short stories I'll flog to Strangeon. You know. To weird tales, you know, it's bizarre but uh.
Highlights
Transcript
Show full transcript
LeeGood evening and welcome to Horror. I'm Lee.
ChrisI'm Chris.
AdamI'm Adam.
LeeAnd we're here with spoilers and swearing this evening to discuss 2005's the Call of Cthulhu.
ChrisWait, I'm sure I watched a 1920s film.
LeeYeah, I I love that aesthetic of this. I think it's such a it it just works for the story.
ChrisIt's excellent.
AdamYes, yes.
LeeSo, so before we get too far into it, for anyone who isn't aware,
Leethis film was made by the Lovecraft Society.
ChrisAs I
AdamHP Lovecraft Historical Society, I'm sure it was.
LeeYeah, thank you.
Leeyes, and he's he's a silent film made in the the style of a 1930s silent film.
Leeyeah, and it's it's I mean it really works for the story.
LeeBut, I'm assuming our listeners will be, versed in HP Lovecraft, but for anyone who isn't, just in case we start talking and you're like, what are you talking about?
LeeHP Lovecraft, obviously was an author from turn of the last century.
LeeSo, actually,
AdamWell, it was it was around the 20s, 30s, 40s, well, actually, the 20s and 30s that he was writing, really. So, yeah, beginning of the 20th century, something.
Leeyes, and he may his stories nearly all, are of about the same world and the same characters, but they're never directly told by the characters themselves who are the old gods.
LeeIt's always people's accidental interactions with them, nine times out of ten.
Leeyeah, and it it's just such an amazing world he's created.
LeeThat's what it is, it's all, you know, all of these stories are all parts of the same narrative, but kind of told from different people's perspectives and, yeah.
AdamHe sort of created his own mythology and, it, weirdly enough, went further than him, so a lot of people then took up the mantle of it like August Derleth and people like that were sort of,
ChrisWe'll weave it into their own stories.
AdamYeah, they ran with the mythology and I think and Lovecraft, I believe, was quite encouraging of that because I think he was very much sort of, well, it's it's there to be used.
ChrisYeah, certainly it's referenced.
AdamI've seen it in games.
ChrisYeah.
AdamOh, certainly now, yeah, it's become.
LeeOh, it's
AdamYeah. And, and as you were saying, Lee, really, it's his because it's it's curious because essentially it's to a greater or lesser extent science fiction, in so much as there's the, as he termed them, the elder gods, which are treated by human beings as magical creatures or gods or sort of, but are actually probably more likely to be just extraterrestrial, extradimensional beings.
ChrisYeah.
AdamAnd, and as you were saying, Lee, really, it's his because it's it's curious because essentially it's to a greater or lesser extent science fiction, in so much as there's the, as he termed them, the elder gods, which are treated by human beings as magical creatures or gods or sort of, but are actually probably more likely to be just extraterrestrial, extradimensional beings.
ChrisYeah.
AdamAnd their
ChrisWe love to put extra layers on things though, don't we?
AdamYeah. Well, it's it's that sort of but also that that lovely sort of thing of they are beyond us.
AdamIt's not it's not a sort of, malicious.
ChrisWell, so in a way, like he almost covers that that tension between science and fantasy.
AdamOh, absolutely.
AdamYeah.
AdamAnd I think, and, because, because a lot of the, a lot of the stories are sort of people, sort of explorers or, you know, people doing scientific investigations, anthropologists and things like that, where they look into these things where it's.
ChrisOh,
LeeWhat have we found here?
AdamYeah, exactly, you know.
AdamAnd, and actually, weirdly enough, I think it's one of those things that's kind of ripe to, and a lot of other mythologies have crossed over with it.
AdamThere's sort of, Cthulhu Mythos Sherlock Holmes.
Adam
Adamthere's you know, there's just so many different thing there they even tied it up at one point there was a a series of what once the original version of Dr the original TV version of Doctor Who finished they had a series of books after that and that actually had some one of the authors in there linked it up that there were creatures from Doctor Who that they then translated onto the Cthulhu gods so stuff like
AdamNaliatep and were analogous to other creatures and things.
AdamBut yeah, certainly Lovecraft sort of, yeah, I mean, I I think, I mean,
Adamalong with, along with his, you know, along with his clear dodgy politics and essential racism, you know, he was, but I I think he was actually, as a person, he was fairly sort of, atheistic.
ChrisHe was like,
AdamYou know, it was like, well, there's nothing, so, you know, he was.
ChrisThat's how it fits with this.
AdamYeah, he was he was basically sort of, you know, the this I've created this mythology if you want to run with it or whatever like that, but it wasn't, you know, it wasn't sort of something he subscribed to.
AdamHe was very much.
ChrisHe's no scientologist, really.
AdamYeah, well, it was yeah, it was very much, no, this is this is the product of my imagination.
AdamThat's it.
AdamIt's not sort of like, you know, because I think, in a weird way,
AdamI think it has almost like sort of outlived him, well, not it's obviously it's outlived him, but it's sort of it's gone beyond that into
Adamalmost becoming its own sort of, you know, like it's now mythology, but not just from one person's mind, it's sort of fed into so many things now.
ChrisIt has.
LeeLike, yeah, that's what, yeah, go on Lee.
LeeI was going to say, yeah, like you said, Chris, you know, like, you know, board games and role-playing games and all that, they've really linked onto it because it's such a a huge universe that he's built, it's rough for that type of thing.
LeeActually, Chris, for Halloween last year, you bought us a a role play game, Cthulhu based one.
LeeWhich we did try.
LeeI'd never tried a role play game before, it was the first one I played.
LeeI played it for. Yeah, really enjoyed it.
Lee
Leeyeah, and and loved all the little Cthulhu-esque figures and stuff so it's so did you were you aware of Cthulhu and were you aware of HP Lovecraft's work Chris before watching this or
ChrisSo I think, you know, really what we were just saying there, I heard of Cthulhu, before really knowing who HP Lovecraft was.
ChrisSo it's yeah, because it had been in like say computer games I'd played over the years and they don't, when the monster appears, it doesn't go,
ChrisThis is by HP Lovecraft.
LeeYeah.
ChrisLike, oh, I've heard of Cthulhu, right, and then you start to realize, oh, yeah, it's,
ChrisAnd, you know, his name, once you, once you're aware of it, then you kind of see it a lot more.
Chrisbut certainly first, the references can be.
AdamAnd it has become a description, a descriptive method Lovecraftian for unusual weird fiction and particularly anything that is essentially, you know, nameless horrors and things from beyond that the human mind can't comprehend.
AdamI know that a lot of people have said that that, Lovecraft's sort of
Adamability as a writer is actually the the the cause of like, well, it was absolutely indescribable and if I tried to, I I would go mad and so would you.
AdamSo I wouldn't describe it.
LeeYeah.
AdamWhich is possibly one of the finest sort of get outs.
LeeYeah.
AdamIt works, you know.
LeeIt does, but it runs so concurrent with MR James as well because it's that same it's nearly always learned scientists who are the people who are, you know,
Leerunning into these things accidentally.
LeeYeah, and it's it's that it's just described as being.
LeeUndescribable.
ChrisWhat would these writers have done before science was a thing?
LeeYeah.
ChrisWho are we going to use, it's just crazy people, basically.
AdamI'm sure I'm sure I'm sure that there would have been people that they would have just regarded as,
Adamhe needs the wind taken out of his sales a bit.
AdamSo,
Adamthat's you know, he used he used to be pomposity.
AdamThat's why that's that's why it was a lot of kings and things like that.
AdamYou know, but I think, but I think, because funny enough, you're saying about the role playing game, that's how the HP Lovecraft Historical Society formed is originally they were, they formed a live action role playing, version of the Call of Cthulhu RPG called Cthulhu Lives.
AdamAnd it was, Andrew Lehman, Sean Braney and Phil Bell, who sort of formed the society, and basically, yeah, it started off that they were larping.
AdamAnd then they started doing a fanzine called Strange Eons and because of that, which was just sort of articles and HP Lovecraft and sort of analysis and things like that.
AdamAnd because of that, they then got such a a sort of build up of membership, they began producing their own films, and the first thing they did was called Shoggoth on the Roof.
AdamWhich is a spoof documentary of, a supposed 1970s production of a musical, which was a a Lovecraft version of Fiddler on the Roof.
Lee
AdamAnd then, so, and then they they, along with that, they did an original cast recording for the of of it.
LeeOkay.
Adamso you could buy the Shoggoth on the Roof, like the the album, and then after that they did, they did a Christmas album, a very scary solstice.
AdamWhich is like Lovecraft Carols.
AdamAnd then, and this is this is also like in the 90s, I think they they originally formed in about 87 or like the society officially sort of became together in 87.
ChrisIt was oriented.
AdamYeah.
AdamAnd then they thought, well, we'll make Call of Cthulhu because the original story is from
Adampublished in 1928, I think it was written in 20, 1926, but it was published in Weird Tales magazine, which published a lot of Lovecraft's work.
AdamAnd, in 1928, and so they were like, well, we'll make it as if it was a film made in 1928, as we say.
AdamAnd,
Adamit's strange that we've done it, it was especially because we did just did House of the Devil, and it's kind of strange that there's,
Adamyou know, we've done a film that was like, right, we want this to look like it was made in 19, like the early 80s.
AdamAnd really stuck to that and everything.
AdamAnd they've done a similar sort of thing, they wanted to make this look like it basically,
AdamI think their concept was if someone had bought the rights to the film there and then and made the film the same year that the story came out.
AdamSo it was like,
Adamyeah, they just, and, you know, so obviously, yeah, it's a silent film.
AdamAnd they've really, I think it's really it's really weird coming back to it because now realizing that it's nearly it's over 20 years old.
Adam
AdamAnd because of that because they've done it as it's not aged in any way.
LeeOh, no.
LeeIt's right.
AdamIt still looks fantastic, but it also is because they've done
Adamthey did such a brilliant job of evoking that sort of 30s look.
AdamAnd when and, you know, it took a long time.
AdamI think it was like the best part of two years putting it together.
AdamAnd, you know, and sort of building lots of sort of false perspective tricks and things like that to do
Adamlike the effects of the city, like the the they on the island.
AdamAnd, and it's all sort of, yeah, they they spent a lot of,
Adamit's a lot of time and effort to make it it sounds bizarre,
Adambut you know, to to make it as close as possible.
AdamIn as close as possible a way to how it could have been made.
AdamThey don't cheat it.
LeeNo.
LeeYeah, or.
AdamAnd everything, and then obviously you're all, yeah, and you get them.
LeeYeah.
AdamThen you get a magnificent stop motion sequence of Cthulhu, which is just, yeah, and done sparingly as well.
AdamWhich I think is again a strength to it.
LeeYeah, well that is how it would have been at the time, wasn't it?
LeeYou know, it was very much the era of you see a shadow in the first 20 minutes, you see a claw after 45 and you sort of peak the monster up.
LeeSo,
AdamYeah.
LeeChris, for your first viewing of this, as someone who's possibly not as well versed with the the whole backstory of, because I think this is a great one because it this one gives you a lot more story in it.
LeeAnd a lot more information.
LeeWhereas a lot of the others, it's a much smaller window into the world, you have to read a lot of stories to build the whole backstory up.
LeeBut what did you make of it watching it as a kind of standalone?
ChrisYeah, especially as this like, what is it, 47 minutes long?
ChrisI mean, they do, they pack, pack a lot of story into it.
ChrisBut it is, so it's a short story, essentially.
LeeIt's one of his longer ones, but it's a short one.
ChrisIs it right?
LeeOkay.
AdamBecause essentially Lovecraft only did sort of short stories and in fact, there's a number of adaptions, what's his name, Stewart Gordon did a lot of adaptions of Lovecraft.
AdamAnd there's a lot of adaptions out there where you're like,
Adamthat is literally a page and a half.
AdamIt's a bit like the same you get the same thing with Edgar Allan Poe.
AdamYou know, where it's like, the Pit and the Pendulum as a story versus the Pit and the Pendulum as the film.
AdamIt's like, right, you have put a lot in here.
ChrisYeah.
AdamAnd still called it the Pit and the Pendulum.
AdamAnd similarly, there's a lot with the Lovecraft stuff, I mean, it's like even Reanimator follows the story,
Adamlike of of the actual short story Herbert West Reanimator.
AdamThe film Reanimator kind of follows that story reasonably closely, but it is updated, it is set in the present day and there's a lot more nudity and gore than probably is in in the story.
AdamYou know, they sort of.
AdamSo this this feels like this is probably one of the closest.
ChrisYeah, okay.
AdamIf not the closest Lovecraft adaptation I've seen.
ChrisIt certainly like it really comes across as being a labor of love.
ChrisIn, you know, like it's not a huge budget.
ChrisBut what they've done really seems to give you a feel for the fact they they love the book, you know, and the the world that he's created.
ChrisSo it's yeah, it's.
LeeIt is, it's it's great.
LeeAnd as you were saying, Adam, with the other adaptation.
LeeSo one of my favorite adaptations is Dagon.
LeeWhich is actually The Shadow Over Innsmouth.
Leebut it.
ChrisYeah, why is that?
ChrisWhat's what's good about that?
Leeyes, so it it was done on a slightly lower budget, but it's very good.
LeeAnd it's it's one of my favorite stories.
LeeSo basically a guy is traveling by bus and has to stop in a place called Innsmouth that all the locals shun because it's a bit weird, and without giving too much away, there's a bit of a pact between the people who live there and the things that live in the sea.
Chrisokay.
LeeAnd he's staying overnight there, he kind of uncovers it and finds himself victim where he knows too much and they want to off him.
LeeYeah, it's it's it's really good and it's because as you as Adam was saying,
Leea lot of it is the unmentionable, the indescribable.
LeeWhat he's putting on screen.
Chrisis quite.
LeeYeah, yeah, definitely.
AdamActually, because I mean there's there's obviously there's the HP Lovecraft.
AdamYou've seen Color out of Space, haven't you, Chris?
ChrisYes.
AdamNicholas Cage.
ChrisYes.
AdamThat is an adaption of HP Lovecraft.
AdamAnd actually, one of the smartest things I ever saw is that I've got a German version of that that, because this has sent me scuttling back to my box of like all the Lovecraft adaptions I bought in the early 2000s.
AdamAnd, yeah, I've got a German version of The Color Out of Space, and the smart trick they do with that is it's in black and white.
LeeYeah.
AdamSo, you don't have to try and create the color that is driving people mad because it's a totally new color.
ChrisYeah.
AdamYeah.
AdamBut as it's filmed in black and white, we can't see that color, so it's, you know,
Adamit's there's people do the and yeah, like you say, Dagon is, I think, one of the more faithful.
Adamadaptations of the stories because a lot a lot of them they sort of spin out from, you know,
Adamit'll be literally we'll take the idea or we'll take this and that.
AdamWhereas I think, and I mean obviously they are.
AdamAn HP Lovecraft appreciation society.
AdamYou know, they are.
ChrisYeah.
AdamYeah.
AdamSo their love is going to be in there, but I think this is one of the most adherent to the story of any that I've seen.
AdamParticularly because they've not only have they made the decision to make it period, but they've actually made the decision to make the film, like the actual concept of the film is the period as well.
AdamYeah.
AdamSo it's not just,
Adamoh, because a lot of the, I mean, Stewart Gordon ones are always modern day, when he does them.
AdamHe never does them sort of as historical.
AdamApart from, no, even, Dreams in the Witch House, the,
AdamMasters of Horror episode he did, I think, is present day as well, isn't it?
LeeI think it was, yeah.
LeeBut again, so that's a very faithful adaptation because you remember, Chris,
Leewe watched Curse of the Crimson Altar.
ChrisYeah.
LeeThat's that's basically supposed to be the Dreams in the Witch House.
LeeAnd if you watch the two side by side, there is almost no correlation between.
ChrisYeah.
Leebut one is.
Leebut one is far more, yeah, one one is far closer to the original book than the other.
LeeI'd been watching Curse of the Crimson Altar for at least 10 or 15 years before I suddenly noticed in the credit,
Leeoh, it's based on Dreams in the Witch House by.
LeeI don't think it is.
LeeI don't think it's anything like it.
LeeBut it's.
ChrisIt is meant to be.
LeeBut even if it works as the impetus for creating a great film, then it's fine.
ChrisYeah.
LeeYeah.
ChrisDefinitely.
AdamI can't remember what it's but there's there's an IP film that is basically a Lovecraft film but they gave it a Poe title, isn't there?
LeeYes, Hanted Palace.
AdamHaunted Palace, that's it.
AdamYeah.
AdamSo, but but he's actually a Lovecraft story, but they just gave it an Edgar Allen Poe title.
AdamSo it would, because they knew the Edgar Allen Poe ones were selling, and Lovecrafts, Lovecrafts sort of resurgence is
Adamreasonably recent, I would say, I mean, the last sort of 20, 30 years is really when
Adamit's now become a thing where like you say, you know, Cthulhu it it's it's like putting the minitor in something.
LeeYeah.
ChrisYeah.
AdamYeah, because it's now reached that stage of myth, which interestingly enough, even something like, you know, Slenderman,
AdamWhere it's reached that point where,
AdamTed's heard of Slenderman, and but, you know, he he doesn't know the backstory.
AdamHe doesn't know it's creepy pasture and it can be traced to a person who first came up with the idea.
AdamAnd yeah, I think that a lot of the Lovecraftian mythology is now just mythology.
AdamIt's just stuff that people know.
AdamIt it rubs shoulders with Griffins and Frankenstein.
ChrisYeah, feels like it's just always been part of our.
ChrisYeah, feels like it's just always been part of our like culture or just.
ChrisYeah, it's passed down.
LeeSo much so much of HP Lovecraft stuff.
LeeI mean, my, yeah, my brother has got a T-shirt that I've wanted for ages and I very nearly went and bought myself a hoodie from the the Lovecraft Society, website.
LeeYeah, the Miskatonic University hoodie.
LeeLike, it's just like all of those and Arkham of course been, you know, brought into the Batman Mythos.
LeeLike, so much stuff that he invented has just absorbed popular culture and as you say, it's as it's as much a a well-known myth as ones that have been around for hundreds if not thousands of years and it gets treated with the same, the same level of respect and which it I mean, it should be.
LeeIt's such a huge, I mean, I love Lovecraft.
LeeI got for Christmas, which is why I was so pleased when you suggested we do this, Adam.
LeeI got a box set of HP Lovecraft books, pretty much all the whole series.
AdamOh, nice.
Leeyeah, in a really nice really nice hard cover but it's lovely.
LeeI'm working my way through and I just read, book of short stories and there are a few in there that I haven't even read before, which was.
LeeYeah.
LeeLike some really good stuff.
AdamYeah, because Dean, because this this is another thing that at one point he, because Dean got me a book long, long time ago now.
Adamand it was, Lovecraft stories that he'd written.
AdamBut under assumed names, and there were a couple in there that were actually published as Houdini stories.
LeeOh, really?
AdamSo he was ghost writing for Houdini, and I think Houdini was sort of like basically was like, I want to do something in Egypt.
AdamKnock it up for us and so he was doing that, so he was, you know, as a writer for hire he was also doing that sort of thing, you know.
Adam
Adamand but yeah, I mean this this is the sort of text of of Lovecraft because it's
LeeYeah.
AdamCthulhu is the is the one that has really sort of
Adambecause obviously you've got, you know, there's all all the others Naliatep and
Adamthe goat of the woods with a thousand young and so on and so forth.
AdamIt's like there's a lot of these sort of everything seems just about right.
AdamAnd and actually the Necronomicon.
LeeLike the just about to say the Necronomicon as well, which obviously later gets used in the Evil Dead and all of that.
AdamOh, so many things.
AdamAnd again, I have seen, you know, I've been on, sort of, you know,
AdamI've been on things online and stuff like that that are treating the Necronomicon that it is an actual book.
LeeYeah.
AdamYou know, there are people it's it's sort of it's weird that it's sort of got tangled up so much in terms of mythology.
AdamThat it's it's people who are saying, you know, that, oh no, Lovecraft wrote some stories, but he actually owned this thing called the Necronomicon.
AdamAnd and it's like, no, no, we're Jesus Christ, lads, we're getting really confused now.
AdamYou know, he made up the book as well, it wasn't that he read the book and then decided, oh, that'd be a good idea for a series of short stories I'll flog to Strangeon.
AdamYou know.
AdamTo weird tales, you know, it's bizarre but
Adamspurred on by this, I did watch also because they, after they did this,
Adamthey also did, they've done a load of plays, like radio plays.
Adamadaptions of his stories that are done like 1930s.
AdamAmerican radio plays like Warson Wells type stuff.
Adamand then I rewatched, the Whisperer in Darkness,
Adamwhich came out in 2011.
LeeI'm currently reading that and I'm sure we watched it when it first came out, but I don't remember an awful lot about it.
LeeSo I think I'm going to have to rewatch that one as well.
AdamYeah, because that that was basically they decided to make that like a sort of 1930s, a bit like a Universal Horror.
AdamAnd I think and and it shares a lot of the same cast like Matt Foer who's the the man as he's described in this, you know,
Adamnot not bigging him up, you know, I mean that's just it's how he's credited.
AdamI'm not saying that he is the man.
AdamBut, and he's like the star of, the Whisperer in Darkness and, yeah, they,
AdamI so I rewatched that and that actually that I think is another one where they've,
Adamreally sort of triumphed in making it look of its time or of the time they have chosen.
AdamSorry.
AdamNot of its time, because it's it's time is actually 2011.
AdamBut,
Adambut yeah, so they've made it look very 1930s.
AdamI mean, the only thing I'd say with that is I think having watched it back.
AdamMaybe it's a wee bit long, but I think that might also just be because again, the majority of like the Universal horrors are maybe an hour and 10 minutes, an hour and something.
AdamAnd this was like an hour 45, but I get also that they were probably going, well, we actually want to make.
AdamA movie.
ChrisYeah.
AdamYou know, because and and because I mean the Cthulhu won a lot of the awards and everything else like that.
AdamBut obviously it's 45 minutes.
AdamSo it's a short.
AdamSo I think they wanted to.
AdamSo I think they wanted to make a feature.
ChrisYeah.
AdamAnd despite the fact, yeah, a feature can be an hour and 10, it's like more commonly these days that you're looking at, you know, between an hour and a half to two hours, sort of counts as a as a film.
Adam
Adambut, but yeah, it still that still sort of like, I think again, it very much stood up because it doesn't it doesn't age.
AdamYou know,
Adamit was it was already meant to look old then.
AdamSo it's.
ChrisMentioning the effects said so this does look, yeah, like really good.
ChrisI did notice, I think, the one of the effects they applied was as the like scratches appear in the corners of the film, it's like it looks like tentacles.
LeeYes.
ChrisRather than just normal scratches.
AdamYeah.
AdamYeah, and there's well, because they've got the lovely thing as well,
Adambecause there's a lot of stuff like the stuff on the sea where it's on the sea, there's a lot of model work and stuff like that.
AdamBut there's also just bits where it's guys in boats, but they are doing the old techniques again.
AdamWhere it's just literally they're on a billowing blanket.
LeeYeah.
AdamAnd it looks amazing and, but again,
AdamI'm really pleased that they like like we said again.
AdamLike we said about with House of the Devil, they put in little bits like hair in the gate and the sort of stuff like that.
AdamAnd sort of stuff that you would see.
AdamBut they haven't like, the more I think about it, I mean, we might have to cover it at some point, but like when it sort of got to that point with like Grindhouse like Rodriguez and Tarantino doing Grindhouse.
AdamAnd it was like, I now look at it going, you really fucking overplayed that of like, we'll put cigarette burns in, breaks and.
AdamAnd it's like, yeah, but you don't have to do it every fucking frame, mate, because it doesn't, you know,
LeeIt's
AdamBest in the world.
LeeIt's distracting.
AdamYeah, it does.
LeeAnd it's with this it didn't, it added to the atmosphere and the feel, but you didn't keep going, there's that hair again.
Lee
LeeOr or you know, yeah.
AdamYeah, it didn't keep taking you out of it because you're going,
Adamoh, wow, yeah, they've put in blur or they've put in, you know, sort of.
AdamThis is the bit where it's like meant to be that they they had different film stuck because it got edited in a foreign country or something like that.
AdamYou know,
Adamit's yeah.
AdamSo, no, I think they they really sit on the right side of taste with it, and then, and so, like the,
AdamAndrew Lehman who directs it also plays, Charles Fort in, the Whisperer in Darkness.
LeeOh.
AdamAnd it was really weird because I watched.
AdamLike the sort of.
Adamthe behind the scenes stuff on the DVD for Call of Cthulhu, and then I thought, I'll watch Whisperer in Darkness, and then it's like, hang on, that's the director.
AdamHe's turned up as Charles, and he's actually in it quite a lot.
AdamYou know, I just thought it might have been just a cameo or something like that.
AdamAnd Sean Braney, who, wrote this or like adapted it, he then wrote and adapted, Whisperer in Darkness.
AdamSo, it's, you know, those guys really know what they're doing.
AdamI'm going to have to make one shout out though to of the other stuff that the HP Lovecraft Historical Society have put out is Organ White and the Amphibian Jazz Band live at the Gilman House.
LeeOh.
AdamWhich is basically an Innsmouth version of Tom Waits croaking his way through from sort of Dagon jazz standards.
AdamIt's fucking brilliant.
LeeI love.
AdamIt's all things, it's all things like my sentimental Cephalopod and stuff like that.
LeeYeah.
AdamAnd it's just, yeah, it's just really great.
AdamAnd they just all their stuff, I think they it's a the HP LH S
Adamare a really talented group who are on like, you know, they've they've got the right level of humor with it as well.
AdamThat they're just sort of like, yeah.
AdamThey just, they know what they're doing and they know why they love Lovecraft and yeah, it's
AdamYeah, this is just, it's, and I'd say it's probably the best adaptation or certainly the straightest.
AdamYou know, or most direct adaptation of a Lovecraft story of any of them.
AdamIt's like if you leaf through the book, oh, what's it called, Lurker in the Lobby.
Adamwhich is a book that's just is basically lists all the Lovecraft adaptations.
AdamAnd, yeah, and they're they're so many out there.
AdamBut,
AdamBut I think this is probably the most spot on.
ChrisThis is like a good origin one too.
ChrisYeah, get going on.
AdamI think, yeah, it just it it's weird because it's like, oh, they've you know, it's it's a product of the 21st century, but they decided to make it look like it was a hundred years older.
AdamBut,
Adamactually, just if you if it's the story beats that you want, they've got it all in there.
LeeYeah.
AdamYou know.
LeeYeah, I mean it it.
LeeAnd this story is a great place to start, as I said, because I think it does it gives you a much bigger picture.
ChrisIt leads you.
LeeYeah, like it works on its own as a standalone story.
LeeI say, but the others kind of once you get to know the elder gods and stuff.
LeeAnd then they're mentioned much less and and you just get these kind of glimpses.
LeeBut once you're aware of them and you know what it means and what it.
ChrisYou can fully appreciate it then.
LeeYeah.
LeeAnd that's why it's so good because you have to read so many and they're all brilliantly written and they're all really good to read.
LeeBut they all give you tiny fragments of information.
LeeSo you end up wanting to read more and more so you can put more and more of the the overall big picture together.
AdamAnd that's I think that's what's attracted a lot of other authors to it is because he left those spaces in there is these sort of hints and remarks and you're like, you'll read one thing and then you'll read one story.
AdamAnd then it's like, oh, hang on, they mentioned Dagon in that.
AdamAnd then it comes back in another story, or it's like, oh, hang on.
AdamSo, oh, so that links to Cthulhu.
AdamYeah.
AdamOr that links to sort of, you know,
Adamthe the lost city of Rile or Rale as I like to call it.
LeeYeah.
LeeI mean it's.
LeeYeah, Lovecraft stuff is fantastic.
LeeAnd so I I do, I find them really enjoyable to reread, it's one of the few things that I can go back to.
LeeAnd because they are fairly short.
LeeI can go back to them and and reread them over and over again.
LeeI mean, the hunter in the dark is one of my favorite and I've read that the hunter of the dark, sorry.
LeeI think I've read that about four or five times.
LeeIt's so good.
AdamIs that that's the other thing as well is I just love the fact.
AdamHis titles almost always stumble you, you always stumble them up.
LeeYeah.
AdamHe has a way of making a title that's just slightly off.
LeeYeah.
AdamIt's like I kept calling it the other day I kept calling it the whisperer in the darkness.
AdamAnd it's like, no, it's the whisperer in darkness.
LeeYeah.
AdamYou know, and sort of, yeah, so he just has this lovely way of like.
AdamSlightly just tripping you up every now and then.
LeeYeah.
LeeFantastic stuff.
Lee
LeeSo, for our next episode, we are going to be covering The Menu.
ChrisOh, I'm getting hungry.
ChrisOr or not, who knows.
AdamOh, no.
LeeOh, have you not seen it yet, Chris?
ChrisI haven't, no.
AdamOh, cool.
LeeOh.
LeeExcellent.
LeeWell,
Adamwell, so from from one mysterious island to another mysterious island.
LeeYeah.
AdamWe shall, reconvene for The Menu.
LeeYeah.
LeeOh,
Leeit's funny, so I saw it when it first came out and then I rewatched it about, oh, maybe last summer.
LeeWe stayed away somewhere for the evening and went out and got back and were too full of food and tired to move anywhere.
LeeTwitch TV on and it was just starting.
LeeYeah, so, I've seen it a couple of times but yeah, I am again, it's it's so mental.
LeeIt's one of those films that you just need to keep going back to because you keep forgetting just how mental it gets.
AdamYeah, and actually you probably did the right thing by watching it, full of food.
AdamBecause I suspect that I will be watching it in like 15 minute excerpts.
AdamAs I keep going off and getting something from the kitchen.
LeeYeah.
AdamYou know.
ChrisWell, it sounds good or tastes good.
LeeYeah.
AdamOne one last thing before we go is I just want to give you the motto of the HP Lovecraft Historical Society.
AdamWhich is Ludo Foramus, which is Latin for we thought it would be fun.
LeeOh.
LeeNice.
LeeVery nice.
Leeyes, so go and check out the Call of Cthulhu.
LeeIt's great.
LeeGo and check out the Whisperer in Darkness.
Leebecause I'll definitely be going and checking that again.
LeeBecause I I need to rewatch it.
Lee
Leeyes.
LeeAnd we will see you go and read all of HP Lovecraft stuff.
Lee
Leebrilliant. Don't look too much into his politics.
LeeJust read his books.
AdamDon't get involved. Certainly don't Google what he called his dog.
LeeRight.
LeeNo, no, no, no.
LeeDon't go there.
Lee
Leeand yes, we will see you all in a fortnight's time for The Menu.
LeeThanks very much.
LeeGood night.
ChrisGood night.
AdamGood night.
ChrisNot Fido then.
AdamOh, no.
