Popcorn
00:35:39
About
Get yourself a costume and slap on your face - we’re off to the cinema for 1991’s “Popcorn”. A film in which we learn that reggae bands cannot be stopped by a power cut; your favourite Martian now owns a movie memorabilia shop; and, as always, if Dee Wallace is your mum, shit’s gonna get weird. Made at that curious cusp of 2 decades, this should be standard 80s slasher fare, but it’s knowing references to horror film lore and elevated tone actually predict the direction the genre would take through the 90s. A fractious production with director and lead actor swapped out a few weeks into shooting, this could have been a real mess - the fact it’s as entertaining and coherent as it is is a testament to all involved. With a likeable cast exhibiting genuine camaraderie and some fine spoofing in the films within the film, this is a neglected little treat for the curious. Watch (or re-watch) to avoid spoilers and join us.
Adam's research
Verbatim lifts from Adam's own words in the episode. Click a timestamp to hear him say it.
- Popcorn as a progenitor of Scream and its one-word title
I have seen a few people online saying. I've seen a few people online saying it's a progenitor of Scream even down the fact that it's unlike all eighties horror films. It's got a one word title. Because most of them after Texas Chainsaw.
- Original films-within-the-film and their genre/era influences
I like I like the fact that rather than they they made their own, they create their own films for it. And unlike say well, for example, Scream, obviously they actually watch Halloween. And talk about it, but it's like, oh, that exists blah, blah, blah, and so on. Whereas these, they were like, no, we're going to we're going to make the films and the the three that they do are so perfect for a like horror film festival, especially like sort of slop. Because you basically you've got two sort of proper that sort of fifties atomic age sci-fi but not really that sci. Um, horror. And uh but also the fact you you've also got like a a clearly sort of like um uh like a Japanese film that with that and and it has that proper it the same time period look. It has that sixties um Japanese film look like the sort of um like the Kaiju films and stuff and like Godzilla franchise things. And yeah, I just love they they all look perfect and are done perfectly.
- John Waters' use of scratch-and-sniff cards in cinema
Yeah, John Waters did for a film, didn't he? John Waters did he gave out scratch cards and you could and you like scratch and sniff sort of thing. So it would come up, it would flash up on the screen and say scratch this card, don't get it wrong though, and it would be the smell of cannabis or whatever it was. Because apparently there was apparently they when they did it the first time round, one of the smells was glue and they just put glue on there. But obviously that's you know, they couldn't do it if they were to do it subsequently. Because you are actually that everyone comes out with that face. You know, to achieve that smell, you wouldn't just like, oh, we'll chuck a bit of glue on the card.
- Initial directorial offers and Allan Ormsby's involvement
But the cuz so I looking at this. Because I've only like I said, I saw it at yours Lee, and I was like, oh, I don't know, you know, I don't know a thing about it, apart from D Wallace, I don't recognize anyone in it. So uh so I like had had a look back on it. But um originally it was meant to be or it was offered to Bob Clark who did um Black Christmas. That obviously we did a few years back. But obviously he he did Porky's and uh a Christmas story. And uh loads of sort of um, you know, uh Murder by Decree, which I I still think we could fit in on here somewhere. … Yeah. Loose Cannons. Children should. Yeah, Death Dream. So. You know, he he and he was basically like he'd started because he'd done PORKY'S and things like that and even though that's not, that's not something anyone should be proud of, you know, he was like basically he was moving away from doing horror. So he was like, oh, I don't I won't do it, but he recommended um Allan Ormsby to direct it. And Alan Ormsby was a guy who'd worked with Bob Clark doing makeup effects and was a writer for some of his horror stuff. So he was like involved with um Children should Play with Dead Things. And um so he got him in, um and he was directing it, and then very quickly in the production, he got replaced by a guy by the credited director Mark Harrier.
- Allan Ormsby's replacement, lead actress change, and Mark Harrier's debut
Uh, and from what I can gather, it's basically because Alan Ormsby was taking so long doing the films within the films. That the actual film proper was falling behind. No. Um. And the so. Essentially what you see in the film is Allan Ormsby directs the the actual films you watch, the Electrified Man and uh Mosquito and is it Mosquito? Yes. Yeah. Um. And uh and the stanch. The stench. And yeah, so he directed all of those, and then uh but and they also had a different lead actress. And so they replaced Alan Ormsby because he was taking too long and they were falling behind schedule. And at that point, they were like, right, we're restarting and they hadn't really the original actress wasn't working out. So. Um, then um so then uh what's her name, uh Jill Jill Showen, Showen came in to play Maggie or Sarah. And um and Bob Clark apparently was kind of still doing second unit directing on it and advising it and. So it seems a bit strange. But I mean, the weird thing is Mark Harrier who they brought in, this is the only film he's ever directed. And he's actually an actor and he's in he's Billy in all three of the PORKY'S films. And he's like been in Murder She Wrote and Freddy's Nightmares and stuff like that. But yeah, this is the only actual film that he's done. And you know, I mean, fair play. Yeah. This is the thing is I I think to to be called in and do do it under those circumstances where it's like, right, we're already behind. We're replacing a lead actress. And you've got to walk in. And get the crew on side, cuz obviously everyone's worked with the first director. And kind of used to him and everything else like that. So I think you know, it's what could have been an absolute shit show. You know, there's no there's no failing in this of competency or anything like that. You know what I mean, it still it still looks good. It still makes sense. And you know, they didn't lose anything, so it's maybe maybe it was just the fact it was such a fucking. Shit show that it's like, do you know what, I don't want to direct anymore. So, you know, maybe maybe that's the case.
- Filming location in Jamaica, derelict cinema, and cast living conditions
Yeah, so and also it was filmed in Jamaica. Which is why there's reggae all the way through the soundtrack and they've got the the band in who who can miraculously play during a power cut. … They were acoustic ketars that they're playing and they. But yeah, it's so it's so and I think that's something that comes across is that so the cast were there but literally. living together. Because they're they've gone to Jamaica to film it, they're filming it in like this derelict cinema or theater. Apparently it was a theater that then got turned into a cinema, like a lot of older theaters did. So it was really old and that's why it's so grand and everything else like that. Apparently, and unfortunately I I saw an interview with Dee Wallace and she was just saying that it just stunk of like piss. Because basically it had just been squatted for like homeless people were using it and stuff for years. And so they were like and presumably also they're on not the biggest of budgets. So it was probably just like just hold your nose and go outside after you've done your take. … Yeah. And um, but yeah, so they were sort of living together. And I do genuinely think that comes across. Is I think everyone, you know, like any film, there are levels of acting chops. But I believe they all know like are a gang. They still I mean, you know, I I sort of feel they're all. Yeah. I think it was you know, I mean obviously there was a lot of stop starting and fucking around and changing actress and directors and uh so on and so forth. And um, yeah, it was even then, they they still managed to have a good time and sort of, you know.
- Creative conflict and director change insights from Blu-ray making-of
And weirdly enough, I I wonder because there's sort of again, there's a there's a good making of on the 88. uh Blu-ray. Um, and sort of like they've they've got some of the cast there and stuff like that. And but it's quite interesting because the mainly they sort of like say, oh, um Alan Ormsby was taking a long time on the thing. But also they were saying that the stuff he was doing the present day for some reason, they don't really describe it, but the producers are sort of talking about it wasn't quite working or whatever like that. And and even like the guy who came in to take over as director's like, oh, I watched all the short films and I was like, what's your problem? This looks great. But then they showed me the other stuff and I was like, oh, okay, that's why I've had to come in and. And I wonder if they were trying to go in a weird way, I wonder if they were trying to make the proper story. feel eighties slash. So it's like, you've done a spot on parody of like them, like the giant ant movie, or you've done a a spot on sort of attack of the 50-foot woman sort of here and stuff and stuff, and now it's like, but also we'll make the film quite, you know, it's here's all the eighties elements that would be in there and stuff like that. So I maybe wonder if he was going in that direction and it was like, no, it needs to we can't undermine this. You know, it's it's sort of it's too close for you to do an affectionate parody, so it's just going to feel like a dick.
- Film's intended PG-13 rating, lack of nudity, and impact of killer's makeup
What I think, I think weirdly enough, as well, is because at that point, you're like, he's an excellent mimic, but the mask somehow helps the fact that his lips are fucked. Because like you say, when he when he's in sort of like his O Naturall form. Um. Which actually that that was another thing, I think I saw that it was um they thought they were going to get PG 13 for this. And actually it does the one thing that is missing for something that would be an 87 horror film is nudity. You know. … And a lot of the kills are not quite they're not horrific. You know what I mean. They're very comedic or they're sort of done like the electrocution is quite OTT. And reflective of the um the movie that they are watching and stuff like that. And um. But I think genuinely, I think it's that makeup that probably tipped it. Because the makeup is really fucking it's terrific, it's a real look. You know, and I think it's sort of probably rang too many sort of Freddy Krueger bells. … Clare put it, it was like, well, you either have the mask but not the burnt eyes or you have the eyes but not the mask. Because altogether, it really is, you know, that's a. You know, that's a a real shocking sort of look. And it has to be said, I mean Tom Villard.
- Actor Tom Villard's performance, death from AIDS, and career challenges
Like who the the killer, Toby. Um. is um fucking brilliant. And once he once he's sort of outed as the killer and he's given free reign. He is fucking extraordinary. … And. Uh, but I mean it's cuz he um he died about three years later. Um, yeah, he died died of AIDS which he'd actually he wasn't, he told the, he told the director. But he hadn't been telling anyone because obviously in terms of like film, like insurance and things like that, you know, you could not as an actor, you would not get you would not be able to work. And so he'd kept it obviously he was trying to keep it to himself but he sort of opened up and told the director. I think out of courtesy more than anything else that it was just so but um. But it's such a shame because he's so good in it and you know, plays just the right level of over the top for a villain for this. Because it really becomes sort of Grand Guignol at the end. And yeah. And uh yeah, it's I think he would have gone on, you know, he would have gone on to have quite a good career. I mean the stuff where he's doing like sort of puppet arms and things like that as well where you're like, you know, he's an incredible like physical actor and so sort of like tall and extraordinary looking that it's sort of like yeah, he would have been um, you feel he would have like been. He probably would have been. A lot of villains. And a lot of memorable ones as well.
- Authenticity and quality of the films-within-the-film
And that's the thing, apart from apart from the stench, unfortunately. You but you you get you you see a lot of um the other two films. You know. And and and they are perfect. You know, because they they are the right sort of thing. Where it's like, no, we've got you know, wooden performances or sort of, you know, sort of bits where it's like, well. If it wasn't for the intervention of God. And it's like, yeah. These are absolutely perfect and the fact that you watch an audience. watching them as you do watch you you would be at a film festival watching these old like Return of the Fly or.
Highlights
Transcript
Show full transcript
Unknown
LeeGood evening and welcome to horror. I'm Lee.
ChrisI'm Chris.
AdamI'm Adam.
LeeAnd we are here this evening as promised for 1991's Popcorn. a film that I cannot believe came out the same year as Terminator 2, but, you know, there you go.
AdamWhat are you talking about? I think they're comparable in effects.
Leeyeah, so just I I realized we we've stopped kind of giving you a rundown of the story, so just a very quick, a rundown of what happens in the film or the setup for it.
Leeso it's a young student at film school, and they are she keeps having recurring dreams.
Leethey they are doing an all nighter at their local cinema to raise a bit of money, and they find an old tape by a guy who ran a film cult, and his the plan for the cult was to run the film and at the end lock the doors and kill everybody, which happened, and they found the the tape and when she watched it, she realized that that was her dream, and then when they do the all nighter, people start getting bumped off all over the place.
LeeSo that is the very quick setup for this movie.
Leeyeah, you've seen this before, haven't you, Adam?
AdamYes.
AdamI've seen this, I saw this once before at your house.
AdamSo that's that's the only time I've seen it before.
AdamAnd I remember I I mean, I enjoyed it then, and equally enjoyed it this time.
AdamSo, yeah.
LeeIt's great, so this was one that Lady Jennifer picked up in Tesco's or somewhere in a pound bin.
AdamYeah, I can see that.
LeeYes, DVD for a quid.
LeeThe cover is the cover alone.
AdamYeah.
AdamWell, I, I, because because I felt because we were doing it, I I thought I'll invest, so I got the 88 films Blu-ray.
LeeOh.
Adam
Adam
AdamAnd
AdamBut yeah, that cover is pure video rental shop.
AdamIt's lovely, and exactly exactly the sort of film you should find in an off license or on a rack in a garage.
LeeYeah.
Adam20 years ago.
LeeYeah.
LeeFantastic. so Chris, with it being your first viewing, what did you make of it?
ChrisYeah.
ChrisYeah.
Chrisso I had a sense that it it was funny.
ChrisSo, as it went on, it was one of those that for me got better and better.
ChrisAnd at the end, I sort of felt like it suddenly seemed like it was ahead of its time.
ChrisAnd then I was like, it's not 1991, but for some reason, it felt earlier.
ChrisAnd then I don't know if that was eighties.
LeeIt was very eighties.
ChrisWas, yeah, right, it really that became clear.
ChrisBut also, I think because of the three films they show, you kind of like you have a sense of those.
ChrisBecause they're all through those are old ones as well, I think.
LeeYeah, so I think they were, I think they were made by them.
LeeBut but the idea is, so William Castle used to do these two.
LeeWe've covered some of his films before.
LeeAnd he used to do.
AdamI was I quickly wrote it down, if you go back to 2018 an episode 33, was when we did House on Haunted Hill.
AdamAnd we discussed a lot about William Castle and his career and stuff.
LeeYeah, so that having something flying across the cinema and having the electric shock seats.
LeeAnd all that that was all stuff that William Castle used to do.
ChrisYeah, I'd say yeah, I thought that was quite good. Yeah.
LeeYeah.
AdamRight.
Lee
LeeYeah, so they use it in this.
Leewhich I like, I like, I think it's a really good nod to and.
ChrisYeah.
LeeYeah, but yeah, I think that it's that, again, I think it's because it's that one massive screen cinema.
LeeThat feels so eighties, like you don't you don't feel like you'd see one of those still in 1990.
LeeSo I think that's possibly why you that part of and the graininess of the film, and the fact Dee Wallace is in it's probably.
LeeBut
AdamYeah.
LeeAll of those are great things in my opinion.
LeeSorry, Chris.
ChrisAnd it's.
ChrisWell, yeah, so I think the film really starts to kick in when they all go to the cinema.
ChrisAnd the amount of different costumes they're wearing, it's like all of a sudden it looks like they probably had a lot of fun making this.
ChrisAnd it starts to become more comedic.
AdamYeah.
ChrisAnd of course, as it goes on, it becomes even more and then the twist.
ChrisIt was almost like a kind of thinking it was like an early draft of.
ChrisOf Scream almost in that, I suppose the character became.
ChrisVery different as well from what you originally think it's going to be.
ChrisSo I was like, yeah, it's like that's quite good.
Chris
AdamI have seen a few people online saying.
ChrisYeah.
ChrisI mean it was.
AdamI've seen a few people online saying it's a progenitor of Scream even down the fact that it's unlike all eighties horror films.
AdamIt's got a one word title.
LeeYeah.
AdamBecause most of them after Texas Chainsaw.
ChrisWait, we keep calling it 1991 Popcorn, but I guess it's not actually called that, is it, it's just called Popcorn.
LeeIt's Popcorn.
ChrisBut is that There are other films called Popcorn?
AdamNo, it's because that's the only way you can find anything about this online if you Google it.
ChrisBecause if you search.
AdamBecause because popcorn and film just does not give enough.
ChrisYeah.
ChrisIt's terrible.
AdamThey're quite intertwined, so you have to go through a few pages before you get there.
AdamSo, yeah.
ChrisThat must be why the year was stuck in my head so much, because I was like, I know it is 1991, but yeah,
ChrisSo no.
ChrisSo it's kind of funny, so yeah, it definitely felt ahead of its time in that sense, even though it was perhaps a bit later than you kind of think it is, while you're watching it.
Chrisbut yeah, and so it did it it sort of kept changing.
ChrisAnd and the characters are fun.
ChrisAnd I I did really like Mark's character arc, because he is awful.
AdamOh, the the the pseudo boyfriend.
ChrisThe attempting yeah, trying to become boyfriend.
ChrisAnd then he's like he's quite a sweet end with him.
ChrisYou're like, yeah, that's all kind of fun.
LeeYeah.
ChrisHe's he's useless still, but at least he's trying now.
AdamIt reminds me of a bit of Jack Burton in Big Trouble in Little China.
AdamIt's someone who's like, I'm fulfilling the hero role, but I'm actually not very good at it.
ChrisYeah, like anti-hero, an early kind of yeah.
ChrisBut also he's he's not he's he seems like he could be charming to begin with, but he's just really not getting it right at all.
AdamOh, no, he's a dick.
ChrisAnd then later on he's like almost matured slightly.
ChrisSo yeah, so I thought that was quite good.
ChrisSo yeah, the characters worked really well together.
Chrisand I liked the whole setup, you know, it being.
ChrisFilms within films and it's a film school and like, yeah.
AdamYeah.
LeeAnd the whole angle.
AdamYeah, cuz I I like.
AdamYeah.
AdamI like I like the fact that rather than they they made their own, they create their own films for it.
ChrisYeah, that's really good.
AdamAnd unlike say well, for example, Scream, obviously they actually watch Halloween.
LeeYeah.
AdamAnd talk about it, but it's like, oh, that exists blah, blah, blah, and so on.
AdamWhereas these, they were like, no, we're going to we're going to make the films and the the three that they do are so perfect for a like horror film festival, especially like sort of slop.
ChrisYeah.
ChrisYeah.
AdamBecause you basically you've got two sort of proper that sort of fifties atomic age sci-fi but not really that sci.
Adamhorror.
AdamAnd but also the fact you you've also got like a a clearly sort of like like a Japanese film that with that and and it has that proper it the same time period look.
AdamIt has that sixties Japanese film look like the sort of like the Kaiju films and stuff and like Godzilla franchise things.
LeeYeah.
AdamAnd yeah, I just love they they all look perfect and are done perfectly.
LeeYeah, they did.
LeeThey really sold it.
LeeAlso I was funnily enough I was listening to a thing a podcast recently where they were talking about because obviously in this one of the gimmicks was they had the smell that came into the cinema.
Adam
Leeand apparently that was a thing that did that in a sixties, I think they were saying.
ChrisAll right.
ChrisYeah, they tried.
LeeThey sort of built a couple of cinemas specifically for it, but it ended up costing so much money that it cost you the equivalent of like £350 in today's money for a ticket to go to the films because all the equipment was so expensive to make it work.
ChrisOh, so you couldn't make that money back on this?
LeeThey must.
ChrisI'd be amazed if people actually really liked it as well.
ChrisBecause surely like pumping bad smells can't actually be fun, can it?
AdamIt depends on your what you're watching, but I certainly wouldn't want it on a scap movie.
LeeI think it was things like like cigar smoke and coffee and flowers.
ChrisYeah, yeah.
AdamYeah, John Waters did for a film, didn't he?
AdamJohn Waters did he gave out scratch cards and you could and you like scratch and sniff sort of thing.
AdamSo it would come up, it would flash up on the screen and say scratch this card, don't get it wrong though, and it would be the smell of cannabis or whatever it was.
AdamBecause apparently there was apparently they when they did it the first time round, one of the smells was glue and they just put glue on there.
AdamBut obviously that's you know, they couldn't do it if they were to do it subsequently.
AdamBecause you are actually that everyone comes out with that face.
ChrisThat's everyone comes out with that face.
ChrisYeah.
AdamYou know, to achieve that smell, you wouldn't just like, oh, we'll chuck a bit of glue on the card.
AdamYou know.
ChrisThat would add to the fun of the film, I'm sure.
AdamOh, absolutely, yeah.
AdamThe audience of people huffing.
AdamIt's like.
AdamI mean.
AdamBut the cuz so I looking at this.
AdamBecause I've only like I said, I saw it at yours Lee, and I was like, oh, I don't know, you know, I don't know a thing about it, apart from D Wallace, I don't recognize anyone in it.
AdamSo so I like had had a look back on it.
AdamBut originally it was meant to be or it was offered to Bob Clark who did Black Christmas.
AdamThat obviously we did a few years back.
AdamBut obviously he he did Porky's and a Christmas story.
LeeYeah.
AdamAnd loads of sort of you know, Murder by Decree, which I I still think we could fit in on here somewhere.
LeeYeah, I rewatched that about a month ago, actually.
AdamYeah.
AdamLoose Cannons.
AdamChildren should.
ChrisIf it's good enough, we should find a way.
AdamYeah, Death Dream.
AdamSo.
AdamYou know, he he and he was basically like he'd started because he'd done PORKY'S and things like that and even though that's not, that's not something anyone should be proud of, you know, he was like basically he was moving away from doing horror.
AdamSo he was like, oh, I don't I won't do it, but he recommended Allan Ormsby to direct it.
AdamAnd Alan Ormsby was a guy who'd worked with Bob Clark doing makeup effects and was a writer for some of his horror stuff.
AdamSo he was like involved with Children should Play with Dead Things.
LeeYeah.
AdamAnd so he got him in, and he was directing it, and then very quickly in the production, he got replaced by a guy by the credited director Mark Harrier.
Lee
Adamand from what I can gather, it's basically because Alan Ormsby was taking so long doing the films within the films.
AdamThat the actual film proper was falling behind.
ChrisNo.
AdamNo.
Adam
AdamAnd the so.
AdamEssentially what you see in the film is Allan Ormsby directs the the actual films you watch, the Electrified Man and Mosquito and is it Mosquito?
LeeYes.
AdamYes.
ChrisYeah.
AdamYeah.
Adam
AdamAnd and the stanch.
ChrisAnd the stench.
LeeYes.
LeeThe stench.
AdamThe stench.
AdamAnd yeah, so he directed all of those, and then but and they also had a different lead actress.
AdamAnd so they replaced Alan Ormsby because he was taking too long and they were falling behind schedule.
AdamAnd at that point, they were like, right, we're restarting and they hadn't really the original actress wasn't working out.
AdamSo.
Adamthen so then what's her name, Jill Jill Showen, Showen came in to play Maggie or Sarah.
AdamAnd and Bob Clark apparently was kind of still doing second unit directing on it and advising it and.
AdamSo it seems a bit strange.
AdamBut I mean, the weird thing is Mark Harrier who they brought in, this is the only film he's ever directed.
AdamAnd he's actually an actor and he's in he's Billy in all three of the PORKY'S films.
AdamAnd he's like been in Murder She Wrote and Freddy's Nightmares and stuff like that.
AdamBut yeah, this is the only actual film that he's done.
AdamAnd you know, I mean, fair play.
LeeI thought we did a really good job.
LeeLike you know.
AdamYeah.
AdamThis is the thing is I I think to to be called in and do do it under those circumstances where it's like, right, we're already behind.
AdamWe're replacing a lead actress.
AdamAnd you've got to walk in.
ChrisYeah.
AdamAnd get the crew on side, cuz obviously everyone's worked with the first director.
AdamAnd kind of used to him and everything else like that.
AdamSo I think you know, it's what could have been an absolute shit show.
AdamYou know, there's no there's no failing in this of competency or anything like that.
AdamYou know what I mean, it still it still looks good.
AdamIt still makes sense.
AdamAnd you know, they didn't lose anything, so it's maybe maybe it was just the fact it was such a fucking.
AdamShit show that it's like, do you know what, I don't want to direct anymore.
LeeYeah.
AdamSo, you know, maybe maybe that's the case.
AdamBut
AdamYeah, so and also it was filmed in Jamaica.
AdamWhich is why there's reggae all the way through the soundtrack and they've got the the band in who who can miraculously play during a power cut.
ChrisAll right.
LeeI said that.
LeeI said.
LeeOh, luckily they've all got acoustic acoustic instruments, and then he said acoustic weapons.
AdamThey were acoustic ketars that they're playing and they.
AdamBut yeah, it's so it's so and I think that's something that comes across is that so the cast were there but literally.
Adamliving together.
LeeYeah.
AdamBecause they're they've gone to Jamaica to film it, they're filming it in like this derelict cinema or theater.
AdamApparently it was a theater that then got turned into a cinema, like a lot of older theaters did.
AdamSo it was really old and that's why it's so grand and everything else like that.
LeeIt looks incredible.
LeeI mean, what.
AdamApparently, and unfortunately I I saw an interview with Dee Wallace and she was just saying that it just stunk of like piss.
LeeOh.
AdamBecause basically it had just been squatted for like homeless people were using it and stuff for years.
LeeOh, no.
AdamAnd so they were like and presumably also they're on not the biggest of budgets.
AdamSo it was probably just like just hold your nose and go outside after you've done your take.
LeeYeah, exactly.
LeeThey can't afford to have the entire place fumigated.
AdamYeah.
AdamAnd but yeah, so they were sort of living together.
AdamAnd I do genuinely think that comes across.
AdamIs I think everyone, you know, like any film, there are levels of acting chops.
AdamBut I believe they all know like are a gang.
LeeYeah.
ChrisYeah.
AdamThey still I mean, you know, I I sort of feel they're all.
ChrisIt seems like they are having a bit of fun together.
AdamYeah.
AdamI think it was you know, I mean obviously there was a lot of stop starting and fucking around and changing actress and directors and so on and so forth.
AdamAnd yeah, it was even then, they they still managed to have a good time and sort of, you know.
LeeAnd I love that like the eighties montages and all that like it's just.
LeeI think that's what adds to the fun of this, like you say, it's although it's you know, 91.
LeeIt does feel like a mid-eighties film, you say, you can kind of see why they were originally going for the director of PORKY'S because it's got that same like college kids feel about it.
Leebut yeah, just with a lot more death.
AdamI think certainly, apart from what even actually even the sort of like drum machine soundtrack is more 87, I mean certainly the one thing me and Clare have been watching.
Adamwe've been rewatching the complete League of Gentlemen, so we've done the series, we're doing the live shows now.
LeeNice.
AdamAnd the rap song at the end of this really feels like when Legz Akimbo come out and try and do a rap to look cool to the.
AdamWhen the name is Johnny and I'm in London now.
LeeYeah, it it does feel like that.
LeeI I mean, I I normally sit through for the half of the credits or anything just to see if anyone have knows pops up or anything interesting.
LeeBut yeah, it was so bad, literally as soon as the first card come up, I was like, nope.
AdamYeah.
AdamAnd it's it's actually weird cuz like the the the reggae side of it sort of like pretty good and pretty unusual for a horror film that you're like, you know.
Adam
AdamBut yeah, I but I I yeah, showed this to me, I'd say 87.
LeeYeah.
AdamYou know, you're nearly in the nineties.
AdamBut yeah, that's where I would have sort of pegged it.
Adam
AdamSo, yeah.
AdamBut.
AdamAnd weirdly enough, I I wonder because there's sort of again, there's a there's a good making of on the 88.
AdamBlu-ray.
Adamand sort of like they've they've got some of the cast there and stuff like that.
AdamAnd but it's quite interesting because the mainly they sort of like say, oh, Alan Ormsby was taking a long time on the thing.
AdamBut also they were saying that the stuff he was doing the present day for some reason, they don't really describe it, but the producers are sort of talking about it wasn't quite working or whatever like that.
LeeYeah.
AdamAnd and even like the guy who came in to take over as director's like, oh, I watched all the short films and I was like, what's your problem?
AdamThis looks great.
LeeYeah.
AdamBut then they showed me the other stuff and I was like, oh, okay, that's why I've had to come in and.
AdamAnd I wonder if they were trying to go in a weird way, I wonder if they were trying to make the proper story.
Adamfeel eighties slash.
LeeYeah.
AdamSo it's like, you've done a spot on parody of like them, like the giant ant movie, or you've done a a spot on sort of attack of the 50-foot woman sort of here and stuff and stuff, and now it's like, but also we'll make the film quite, you know, it's here's all the eighties elements that would be in there and stuff like that.
AdamSo I maybe wonder if he was going in that direction and it was like, no, it needs to we can't undermine this.
LeeYeah.
AdamYou know, it's it's sort of it's too close for you to do an affectionate parody, so it's just going to feel like a dick.
LeeYeah.
ChrisYeah.
LeeBut yeah, I and it and it's it's funny, yeah, you say that, you know, they obviously shipped everybody out to Jamaica and did it.
Leebut yeah, that that that theater is just so, but like you say, you can.
ChrisIt works perfectly, doesn't it?
LeeAs soon as you see it, you can smell popcorn.
LeeIt's that like it is, it's just like you know yeah, and the the stuff of them cleaning it, you know, sort of tidy it and getting the prepping everything ready.
LeeIt's an incredible building, so yeah, if it'd be derated, it must take ages for them to make it look good again.
LeeYou know, like.
AdamIt looks sort of, yeah, it looks habitable.
AdamI'm, you know, I think a lot of that cleanup was probably what was going that that must have been what was going on anyway.
AdamAs you say.
AdamCuz it's sort of fact that's probably the easiest way to do it is you do do your opening sequence while it's derelict and then.
LeeYeah.
ChrisI do think like even though I enjoyed it as much as I did watching it on my own.
ChrisIt definitely does lend itself to, you know, a fun night of putting on a movie at a party.
ChrisAnd not not worrying too much about it, having laughed in the background.
LeeYeah, something daft in the background.
ChrisThere's there's a few inconsistencies, there's a bit like, but it's just not, you know, you don't need to think too hard.
ChrisYou just.
AdamIt's.
AdamIt has a weird thing where it's like there's little bits where you go, is this supernatural and it's not?
ChrisYeah.
AdamBut in a weird way, that's kind of a lot of slashers.
ChrisYeah.
ChrisI thought that they they managed to get that balance okay.
ChrisI thought, yeah, certainly from the start, you definitely think it's going in that direction and then it doesn't and it yeah, and it worked.
LeeSo I normally find that very disappointing if I think it's going to be supernatural and then it is and I'm like, oh, it's Scooby Doo me again.
LeeBut actually it isn't.
LeeYeah, I I thought it it made it a lot more believable and a lot more I mean, not believable, obviously, but yeah.
ChrisThe bit with just how great he was doing making the faces now quickly, I was like, that's impressive technology there.
ChrisI'm sure they wouldn't look quite that good.
ChrisBut that was even really entertaining when he was showing her and Sarah.
LeeBut that's what made me laugh.
LeeSo they, you know, all right, so spoilers from here on in people, just to let you know.
LeeSo when the killer is revealed and yeah, he's doing that talking to a bit, why don't they just keep him as the face that he has assumed?
LeeBecause when they then put those stupid rubber lip things on him, he can't talk through them and you can't understand him.
LeeAnd I was like, just you there, we know who it is.
LeeYou can just show him the way that we know he should look.
LeeYou don't need to do.
AdamWhat I think, I think weirdly enough, as well, is because at that point, you're like, he's an excellent mimic, but the mask somehow helps the fact that his lips are fucked.
AdamBecause like you say, when he when he's in sort of like his O Naturall form.
Adam
AdamWhich actually that that was another thing, I think I saw that it was they thought they were going to get PG 13 for this.
AdamAnd actually it does the one thing that is missing for something that would be an 87 horror film is nudity.
LeeYeah.
AdamYou know.
ChrisYeah, yeah, I was actually expecting a little bit from the way it was going.
AdamAnd a lot of the kills are not quite they're not horrific.
AdamYou know what I mean.
ChrisNo, they are.
AdamThey're very comedic or they're sort of done like the electrocution is quite OTT.
LeeYeah.
AdamAnd reflective of the the movie that they are watching and stuff like that.
AdamAnd
AdamBut I think genuinely, I think it's that makeup that probably tipped it.
LeeYeah.
AdamBecause the makeup is really fucking it's terrific, it's a real look.
AdamYou know, and I think it's sort of probably rang too many sort of Freddy Krueger bells.
LeeYeah.
ChrisI was getting a little bit of that.
AdamClare put it, it was like, well, you either have the mask but not the burnt eyes or you have the eyes but not the mask.
AdamBecause altogether, it really is, you know, that's a.
ChrisIt's memorable enough.
AdamYou know, that's a a real shocking sort of look.
AdamAnd it has to be said, I mean Tom Villard.
AdamLike who the the killer, Toby.
Adam
Adamis fucking brilliant.
LeeYeah.
LeeHe is.
AdamAnd once he once he's sort of outed as the killer and he's given free reign.
AdamHe is fucking extraordinary.
LeeYeah.
LeeHe is really, really good.
LeeYeah.
AdamAnd.
Adambut I mean it's cuz he he died about three years later.
LeeOh, really?
Adamyeah, he died died of AIDS which he'd actually he wasn't, he told the, he told the director.
AdamBut he hadn't been telling anyone because obviously in terms of like film, like insurance and things like that, you know, you could not as an actor, you would not get you would not be able to work.
AdamAnd so he'd kept it obviously he was trying to keep it to himself but he sort of opened up and told the director.
AdamI think out of courtesy more than anything else that it was just so but
AdamBut it's such a shame because he's so good in it and you know, plays just the right level of over the top for a villain for this.
AdamBecause it really becomes sort of Grand Guignol at the end.
AdamAnd yeah.
LeeYeah.
AdamAnd yeah, it's I think he would have gone on, you know, he would have gone on to have quite a good career.
AdamI mean the stuff where he's doing like sort of puppet arms and things like that as well where you're like, you know, he's an incredible like physical actor and so sort of like tall and extraordinary looking that it's sort of like yeah, he would have been you feel he would have like been.
AdamHe probably would have been.
AdamA lot of villains.
AdamAnd a lot of memorable ones as well.
LeeYeah.
LeeYeah.
LeeYeah.
LeeHe does, he's got that California look about him as well, doesn't he, that works quite well in in Hollywood in the nineties.
LeeSo, yeah, I I think, yeah, I think he would have gone on to do really well.
LeeBut I mean, yeah, he's excellent in this.
LeeAnd and you say, I love I love the the way that he he changes so much when he stops being the character of Toby, and then just becomes and that's when he starts, he starts seeing it all fall apart as soon as he's got the mask off and people know.
LeeBut yeah.
LeeIt it it's yeah, it's really, really good.
LeeAnd I've I've seen this film probably three or four times and I had forgotten that it was him, so I watched it the whole time thinking as you're supposed to, that it was the bloke who body was never found from the initial.
ChrisThe old lanyard gate.
ChrisYeah.
LeeOnly when Toby sits down and puts his arm around Maggie that I was like, oh, hang on a minute, there's something not right with this.
LeeYeah, then that's when it all come flooding back to me.
LeeI was like, oh shit, yeah, it is him.
AdamIt.
AdamAnd it's quite it's quite nice that it's a sort of double step reveal because it starts off she's having the dreams, then they see the the movie and she realizes it's not dreams, it's memories.
Chris
AdamAnd at that point, you're like, all right, so she's the little girl in the dream, blah, blah, blah.
AdamAnd that feels like we've blown your twist quite early.
LeeYeah.
ChrisYeah.
AdamBut not not that it's a twist, but you know what I mean, you've you've blown the sort of like uncovering thing.
ChrisYeah, we definitely know what's going on now, but.
AdamAnd then they spent so long misdirecting you and then it's like, oh, nothing to do with this, you know, what he he is the cause of this.
AdamBut, you know, he is dead, and this person this other person just happened to be the misfortune to be there.
AdamAnd sort of go on from there.
AdamAnd it's actually quite nice that you've got that sort of because you like I say, you think, oh, well, it's a bit bit basic.
AdamAnd it's like, oh, no, actually, now you've gone you've gone.
LeeYeah.
LeeAnd again, it's a lot of film for 91 minutes as well.
Adam
AdamAbsolutely.
AdamWell.
AdamYou.
AdamYou get almost.
AdamAnd that's the thing, apart from apart from the stench, unfortunately.
AdamYou but you you get you you see a lot of the other two films.
ChrisYeah.
AdamYou know.
AdamAnd and and they are perfect.
LeeYeah.
AdamYou know, because they they are the right sort of thing.
AdamWhere it's like, no, we've got you know, wooden performances or sort of, you know, sort of bits where it's like, well.
AdamIf it wasn't for the intervention of God.
AdamAnd it's like, yeah.
AdamThese are absolutely perfect and the fact that you watch an audience.
Adamwatching them as you do watch you you would be at a film festival watching these old like Return of the Fly or.
LeeYeah.
AdamYou know.
AdamWhat.
AdamWhatever it is.
LeeAnd I love that, I mean, I think the closest we've ever been was when we went to the John Carpenter all nighter at the Prince Charles.
LeeBut that that like it's films that everybody knows and you've all seen them, so you're all going to shout at the screen and you're all going to throw popcorn at one another.
LeeLike I love that.
LeeAnd I I just wish that that were a real thing.
LeeBut yeah, I think in my now 40 something head, all I kept thinking the whole time they were frying that popcorn was.
LeeSomeone's got to clean all that shit up at the end of the night.
LeeLike it.
LeeIt's going to be everywhere, that's going to be a nightmare.
LeeWhat are you going to do?
LeeBut yeah.
ChrisProbably makes that place smell better, but.
LeeYeah.
AdamThat's true, yeah.
AdamGive it give it back the old feeling.
AdamYou know.
LeeYeah, so yeah, always it is always a fun watch this film.
LeeAnd I think it's why I go back to it quite often, but yeah, like you were saying, Chris, it's it is one of those, I think that's why I forget the twist.
LeeBecause this is a late night movie for me, this is the I should be going to bed.
LeeBut I've got a half an hour left, so I'm going to chuck something on for an hour.
Leeyeah, because you can just come in and just enjoy it, and if you don't get to the end, it doesn't matter, you've had a nice, you know, you had a nice half an hour getting there.
LeeSo, yeah, so I think that's why I've.
LeeI I go for it quite often and again, it's that whole, I love the old cinema look and feel and that.
LeeSo, yeah, so it's just a like comfort food movie for me, really, this one.
LeeSo
AdamAnd I can I can see that.
AdamBut then I but also and this is the bit where it gets controversial.
AdamPrefer it to Scream.
LeeOh, do you.
LeeYeah.
ChrisThat's interesting.
AdamYeah.
AdamSo.
ChrisCuz we did.
ChrisWe didn't we covered Scream fairly recently.
ChrisI mean, it's probably about 10 years ago now, but it feels fairly recently still.
ChrisBut and and.
AdamEvery 18 months for the past two 1998.
AdamYeah.
ChrisYeah.
ChrisBut I did actually quite enjoy watching that again.
ChrisI mean, I hadn't seen it, I probably had only seen Scream once or twice.
ChrisBut.
ChrisSo I I still kind of liked that.
ChrisI did quite like the similarities.
ChrisIt was also the other one was Who Framed Roger Rabbit because there's a bit of a manic twist to a Christopher Lloyd.
LeeYes.
LeeOh, yeah, I've not seen that in a very long time.
LeeI could rewatch that, I think.
LeeI think I saw that at the cinema when it first came out.
LeeI might have seen it once or twice since then.
ChrisBut yeah, I can remember being young enough when I saw it at the cinema and that was a bit a bit of a bigger twist than I was expecting.
AdamThis is something that I've seen come up, maybe we'll get people to, we'll have to get we'll we'll discuss it off air.
AdamBut I know that Roger Rabbit comes up as a child horror.
ChrisYeah.
ChrisWell, yeah.
ChrisI mean, it felt a bit.
AdamYeah, it's a bit where you're like, actually, this is a bit fucking much.
ChrisWhen he was in the steam boiler and he's like and he's gone proper manic.
ChrisYou like what.
AdamI know that it's quite that level.
AdamBut yeah, maybe we'll have to look into this and you know, we'll find these ones where it's not they're not necessarily a horror film, but they they have particularly kids films because they'll be.
ChrisSome shocking moments.
AdamAnd and I mean, let's face it, kids films and fucking like the the orphaning being orphaned and everything else like that, you know, I mean, that's like part and parcel.
AdamI mean, Disney wipes out families sort of left right center.
AdamYou know, that's that's almost the thing, he's like, no, make make sure they're an orphan.
AdamCome on.
LeeYeah.
AdamYou know.
AdamMild peril, my fucking ass.
LeeI'm so.
Leeso, speaking of mild peril, we will be should apologize again for the fact that we took we missed an episode, yes, it's been the school holidays.
ChrisLong time.
LeeSo we've all been really busy and honestly.
LeeWe just couldn't find time, I know that sounds ridiculous.
LeeBut we couldn't find a time for the three of us to sit down and get together for an entire two weeks.
Leeso, yes, we do apologize about that.
LeeBut hopefully, you're all out doing things.
LeeIn the middle of the crazy heat and everything anyway, so you won't have missed us too much.
LeeIt's fine.
Lee
LeeBut yes, so to make it up for to you, we're going to be back in a fortnight's time and we are finally.
LeeI can't believe we haven't done it yet and I say that all the time.
LeeWe are going to be coming back to discuss Baba Hotep.
ChrisOh.
AdamOh.
Leeyeah, I mean, just so looking forward to.
LeeAgain, this is one of those films, I really, really enjoy, but I don't know why it doesn't come off the shelf as much as it should.
AdamI haven't seen it for a long time.
AdamI'm hoping that it that's not going to be like a reaction to, I don't think it is, but, you know, it will be interesting to watch.
AdamAnd I again, it's one is for me, it's one of the list of stuff.
AdamOh, I really have why have I not shown Clare.
LeeYeah.
AdamBaba Hoep.
AdamYou know, cuz cuz that's face it, this is more than this is more than a horror film.
AdamThis is a concept.
AdamAnd a fucking extraordinary one.
LeeSo.
LeeYeah.
LeeIt is.
LeeUnbelievable.
LeeI mean, yeah.
LeeHow he.
LeeHow he came up with it, I will never know, but I'm very glad he did.
LeeBecause I think it was one of those things when Adam first told me about it coming out and what it was going to be about, I don't think I believed him.
LeeI think I felt that he was winding me up.
LeeBecause it sounded so completely impossible as a.
LeeNobody's going to fund that, nobody's going to make that movie.
LeeWell, they did, and we're going to watch it and discuss it in two weeks time.
ChrisOh, I'm definitely looking forward to that.
LeeOh.
AdamYeah.
Adam
Adam
AdamYeah.
AdamYeah.
AdamYes.
AdamYeah.
AdamIt's.
AdamYes.
AdamOkay.
AdamIt's.
AdamYeah.
AdamYep.
AdamYes.
AdamYes.
AdamYes.
AdamYes.
AdamYes.
AdamYes.
AdamYep.
AdamOkay.
AdamYes.
ChrisI take it you've not seen it before, Chris.
ChrisNo, I just remember both of you talking about it excitedly, probably several times, you lucky bastard.
LeeYou lucky bastard.
AdamYou lucky.
LeeYou lucky bastard.
AdamYes.
AdamYes.
AdamYes.
AdamYes.
AdamOh.
LeeOh.
AdamYeah.
LeeYeah.
LeeYeah.
AdamYeah.
LeeYeah.
AdamYeah.
LeeYeah.
AdamYes.
AdamYes.
AdamYes.
AdamYes.
LeeYeah.
AdamYes.
LeeRight.
LeeThank you so much for listening, everybody.
LeeGo and check out Popcorn from 1991.
Leego and check out Baba Hoep.
LeeBecause we will be spoiling the absolute life out of it.
Leeand we will see you in a fortnigh's time.
LeeThanks very much.
LeeGood night.
ChrisGood night.
AdamHat and Hat.
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