Theatre of Blood

0:23LeeGood evening and welcome to horror. I'm Lee.

0:26ChrisI'm Chris.

0:27AdamI am Adam.

0:28UnknownI'm Claire.

0:29LeeYes.

0:31ChrisYes.

0:32LeeClaire is with us. I am. I so Claire chose this for her birthday choice. I I know me and Adam were very excited about this. We will get Chris's feedback later, but knowing Chris as well as we do, I think he may be in for a big post COVID hug next time you see him.

0:59Leeso yes so so we've covered this evening Theatre of Blood with the always impeccable Vincent Price. and in the run-up to this, let's start with Claire. Have you seen anything apart from this movie horror related recently which you particularly enjoyed?

1:19UnknownYes, I have. I watched a documentary called what is that is what we watched.

1:25ChrisNo, what we watched is that's where I dropped down.

1:26UnknownOh, that's what we What's it called? Last Soul. Last Soul.

1:28LeeLast Soul. Oh, the Island of Dr. Moreau.

1:32UnknownYes.

1:33LeeYes.

1:34UnknownI knew nothing about the film. I knew nothing about it apart from I'd seen it on The Simpsons.

1:43LeeHorror.

1:44UnknownYes.

1:45LeeBut

1:45AdamAs as I said, technically they they are actually doing The Island of Lost Souls with Charles Laughton. But it and translates very much to sign.

1:55UnknownBut yeah, we watched that and it was just brilliant. It would It's made me want to watch the film because I think if there wasn't a film at the end of it, it would be hard to believe that everything that happened happened

2:13LeeYes.

2:14AdamYeah.

2:15Unknownin that documentary. And just the phrase if if I was making a movie about Val Kilmer's life, I still wouldn't cast that prick. it's just it's art.

2:31AdamYeah. Yeah, it's we funny enough we spotted it it's it's on Shudder. I have I have got it on Blu-ray, which actually has extended stuff, but we've seen we've seen it anyway.

2:43AdamBut yeah, they've got it on Shudder at the moment and I don't know if I don't know if you've seen it, Chris. I don't know if you have actually, Lee.

2:51AdamDid you

2:51LeeI've not. No.

2:52AdamOh. Christ, it's a it's a it's a total recommend. It's

2:56UnknownIt's really good.

2:57Adama bit like you know you know like there's lots of Terry Gilliam ones

3:01LeeYeah.

3:02Adamwhere it's like Terry Gilliam and how much God hates him because he sends natural disasters and things like that. It's a bit like that, but it's obviously the original director is Richard Stanley.

3:17LeeYeah.

3:17AdamAnd he yeah, him just sort of starting off, he is one of the best talking heads you will ever see because he is monstrously funny and it does tell you some great anecdotes especially about when I hired a mystic whose name was Skip.

3:37AdamAnd I got him to perform a ritual when I was going to meet the producers. And he's you know I'm he's just wonderfully brilliant anyway. And then Val Kilmer turns up as a cackling villain of an asshole that we all knew he was.

3:53UnknownYeah.

3:54AdamAnd then Marlon Brando turns up as basically God playing with them as if they were his private parts. He gives no fucks.

4:04UnknownHe I mean there's one point in the documentary where Val Kilmer is so up his own ass. He's not coming out of his trailer until Marlon Brando comes out of his trailer.

4:17UnknownAnd Brando is not coming out of his trailer until Val Kilmer comes out of his. Because they're both the stars, so neither was coming out first.

4:26ChrisWait can we just pause there a moment? Did you dislike Val Kilmer before seeing this? Did you say?

4:32UnknownI always thought like my nan had a phrase of if he was chocolate he'd eat himself.

4:41ChrisSo where did that come from? I've never heard of Val Kilmer being overly arrogant before. Not that I I don't even know him very well, you know, because I obviously know him like I know all celebrities, but

4:53AdamHe's notoriously trouble.

4:55LeeYeah.

4:56AdamI have heard that. This goes to prove quite how bad he is. But I have heard

5:02LeeDon't forget he did play Jim Morrison in a film. He does look a bit like him, but he's also absolute raging attention whore. So I think he probably got it more on that than

5:14UnknownI think he he was easy to work with and fun to work with. If someone was play played Batman and Jim Morrison, they'd still be working now.

5:23LeeYes.

5:23UnknownLike

5:24ChrisThat's that's a good point.

5:26UnknownHe would just not work anymore.

5:28AdamIf he was pleasant to work with, he would have we wouldn't know who Tom Cruise was.

5:33UnknownUh-huh.

5:34AdamTom Cruise would be like an '80s trivia question. But because Val Kilmer's such a tit, you know, and and Brando obviously had has got a reputation, but Brando Brando is there for devilry.

5:50AdamHe's like he's like an imp.

5:51UnknownHe's causing mischief.

5:53AdamAnd and obviously we've got stuff in and obviously you get the stuff in there that there's the tiny actor who's in Island of Lost Moreau who basically is dressed as Moreau.

6:06AdamAnd that's where Mini Me comes from. It's where Mephisto and Kevin from South Park comes from and stuff like that. And that was entirely Marlon Brando because he turned up and he was like I like this little this little guy.

6:20AdamI like him. Yeah, he should be dressed exactly like me and appear in every scene with me. And it was like yes, Mr. Brando.

6:27UnknownBut then let's also not forget that Brando also said what I should do is my character should wear a hat the entire film. At the end take it off and there's a blow hole and he's been a dolphin all along.

6:40AdamYeah.

6:41UnknownLet's just not forget he said that too.

6:43AdamNow it's unfortunate because obviously the story with Richard Stanley is he got chucked off and replaced with a different director. And that 's before Brando even arrived to film it or anything else like that.

6:53AdamI do get the impression that he would have actually gone with that and just been like that's an amazing idea, Marlon. We need to We'll close down for two months while we Yeah, you go and work with dolphins.

7:05AdamWe'll get the makeup guys to do the whole And but basically yeah, so they pay off Richard Stanley and send him on his way. Richard Stanley goes to the airport and disappears.

7:17AdamHe never turns up in America again. So the production are panicking because they don't know what's happened to Richard Stanley.

7:24UnknownBecause just before that he did threaten to blow up the entire set. That's why they're panicking.

7:30AdamWell, he threatened to blow up the entire set and he also spoke to a local Aboriginal about cursing it. and it was but basically yeah, there's two drivers on it who are like the most Australian

7:45UnknownYeah.

7:46Adamlike guys who work on a film you've ever seen. And they said oh yeah, we I was in this I was in this bar and guy said there's this I met this crazy Englishman and he's he was there staying saying Val Kilmer had fucked his life.

8:03AdamThey're like oh, they must be rich. So they went and found Richard Stanley and smug would him back onto the film. But seriously it's so worth

8:14UnknownIt's brilliant.

8:15AdamYou know we're only scratching the surface of what makes it compelling. But yeah, some of the stories are just

8:22UnknownYeah.

8:23ChrisWhat what was it called?

8:25AdamLost Souls.

8:26ChrisLost Souls.

8:27AdamAnd yeah, I think it it's definitely it's on Shudder. I think it's on Shudder. it's definitely on I definitely saw it on Amazon Prime, but I've got Shudder through that.

8:35AdamSo yeah, I'm sure Shudder.

8:36ChrisYeah.

8:38UnknownYeah.

8:38AdamAnd yeah, well worth a watch.

8:41LeeExcellent. Fantastic. Yeah, I've I've underlined that, so we're definitely going back to that in the week. Thank you very much. Adam, have you caught up with anything in the week?

8:51Adamonly other thing was I watched Robocop. just I've got it on Blu-ray. Haven't seen it for I mean not that long, maybe a few years or whatever like that.

9:02AdamStill holds up. It's actually quite a weird one to watch at the moment because obviously there is the stuff in there like you it's halfway of you've got cops trying to like saying they're going to go on strike and stuff like that.

9:16AdamSo a lot a lot of it feels pretty pressy and as well as obviously the whole thing about you know militarizing the police and stuff like that. and but then weirdly there is the element of it where there is those that retain their integrity in the film are it's because I'm a cop.

9:36AdamAnd it 's like sort of that it's like there's a differentiation in their heads with the people who are fucking it.

9:43LeeYeah.

9:44AdamDo you know what I mean? And it's so that's quite that that I think just yeah, just in light of the moment seem quite pressy and but still great.

9:52AdamI mean you watched half of it with me and then I went to bed, didn't you get

9:55UnknownI did. Yeah.

9:57AdamBut I did get to tell her about the bit in the lift where it's yeah, I called the old man Iron Balls.

10:03LeeOkay.

10:04AdamI and then what was it and then just the the version of it that ends up on the adapted version that was on ITV years ago. I even called him Airhead.

10:17AdamYou You've called him a lot worse and then Airhead seems quite out of the thing, you know. but yeah, that's obviously great. And then last night for no good reason I decided I was going to watch an episode of The X-Files because I couldn't find an X-Files to actually watch.

10:32AdamAnd X it was next to X on the search thing, so yeah, and I watched an episode and it was the episode with I I thought fuck it, I'll just pick a one at random that I've heard is good.

10:44AdamSo I watched the new one with Reece Darby in it. And yeah, that is a proper what that would be back in the day one of those X-Files episodes like Humbug or something like that.

10:55ChrisOh, really?

10:55AdamYeah, or Clive Barker's final repose and things like that where they're quite the quirky ones or the funny you know the ones that sort of poked fun at it.

11:04ChrisYeah.

11:05AdamWell, yeah, Reece Darby's in it. Shangela Laquifa Wadley's in it. It's So there's some there's some good good members of the cast. And thingy Reece Darby is dressed as Colchack.

11:22AdamHe's dressed exactly like Colchack, The Night Stalker. So yeah, yeah.

11:25ChrisInteresting.

11:27Adamso yeah, that's that's that's what I've been watching, but that I'm going to definitely start I think there's no way on earth I going to watch 10 series of The X-Files.

11:36AdamI bottomed out around about series three years ago and I've caught little bits now and then. But I think I don't mind going back and watching or sort of watching odd episodes.

11:47AdamTreat like the anthology series it it kind of is.

11:50LeeYeah.

11:51ChrisCould Could you take a few episodes out of each series and sort of make her you know the best of

11:56AdamThat's what I'm thinking because there's stuff like I mean obviously there's a lot of classics in there. You'd have to include Squeeze. I think that's like the first apart from the because that's like the third episode, but that's the first one.

12:09AdamThat's the with the guy can stretch your vents.

12:11LeeYeah.

12:12AdamEugene Tooms. and then yeah, there's and then he did a sequel. There's there's a few sort of Humbug definitely be one. there's a lot of and there's the there's even one called what is it?

12:27AdamI think it's just called Agents. And it's basically an episode of Cops. So they did their kind of found footage episode years ago. In a weird way is they basically it was like Cops that it was two people like these reporters were working with Mulder and Scully.

12:46AdamAnd it was just seeing them as through this documentary crew's eyes and stuff. And that was that that was a pretty good one. So yeah, the weirdly enough I think that's something that we might come we should come back to as a podcast.

12:58ChrisWe possibly should because I never really saw much X-Files. I definitely saw one or two episodes. but I did know about Gillian Anderson because I think she was rated as the sexiest woman in the world by GQ at the time.

13:14ChrisAnd my friends loved reading GQ or and by here yeah. And now what's interesting is Shirley started watching sex education. And so she's watching it behind me in the office.

13:27ChrisAnd so every so often sort of hear sex related talk and it's Gillian Anderson saying it and it's like

13:32AdamIf only this had been out back then.

13:36ChrisYeah.

13:37UnknownI'm with you, Chris. I think I've only seen two two two episodes.

13:40ChrisOkay.

13:41UnknownYeah, I don't think I've seen many at all. Again The Simpsons has provided most of X-Files already.

13:49Leethere's a There's a fantastic episode with Giovanni Ribisi with the the soundtrack for the episode is all done by tracks from The Vandals, which

14:01AdamOh, really?

14:02LeeYeah. It's so it's him before he was famous just playing a small character. if I remember it's something to do with him he can he can conduct electricity and fire out lightning like the Emperor.

14:15AdamI seem to recall that. Yeah.

14:17LeeYeah. But yeah, all all the soundtrack from it is all The Vandals and it's him. So

14:21ChrisOh, nice.

14:22Leethat's one worth going back and watching.

14:24AdamThere's there's another one. There's the story of the cigarette smoking man. That's a good episode. That's definitely worth checking out.

14:30ChrisCigarette Smoking Man.

14:32AdamYou know the guy who was Cancer Man.

14:35LeeYeah. He was like the smoking in the background. Yeah, but they did a yeah, they did an episode about like his and it was like him it was basically it was all the things of every conspiracy that he's been involved with.

14:51LeeSo he shot Kennedy. Stuff like that. But in the but in the but the whole thing was actually about him being a failed writer. And it was him trying to get like a science fiction story published with loads of people just like sending it back saying that's rubbish.

15:07LeeNo one would believe this shit. And it's like we've robbed the government's alien conspiracy. I know I've been to Roswell, you know. It's And he just can't get anything published.

15:19LeeEveryone thinks he's just writing bullshit sort of crappy alien Nice. I did want to say actually Claire how proud we all are here at Welcome to Horror of you for keeping up with all the things we've been watching.

15:36LeeFor somebody who initially said I I don't watch horror and I've got no interest in it, you've delved quite deep on some of the episodes. Things like let the right one in spoiler alert next episode previous episode.

15:51LeeNext episode now when this is it fuck knows

15:56AdamIt's It's a previous episode.

15:57LeeIt's a previous episode, but it hasn't actually aired yet. but yeah, lots of getting involved in that type of stuff which I'd put quite high up this scary scale really.

16:07UnknownWell yeah, and when like before I started watching like I would say ghosts and and vampires were like right up at the top for things that shit me up.

16:23UnknownAnd like I was saying to you, Lee, like I did not watch The Ring because I've watched The Ring and I hate it. But yeah, I thought thought that the right one in was sweet.

16:38UnknownI thought it was sweet of you. But cuz it was nice to see a vampire story that isn't all sexy cuz vampires are just made sexy. And it was nice for them that not to be the case.

16:54UnknownThe fact that she was a vampire I don't know you could have made a a different film but her not being a vampire. That's just such If you change the story, it could be a different film.

17:08UnknownYeah, no, you're right. It's

17:09LeeI'm really enjoying it. And I'm the more I'm watching, the more I'm finding out that horror isn't just about how scared can you make someone Yeah.

17:20UnknownI'm I'm I'm glad to hear it. I think that's one of the things we've we kind of we've been trying to instill in people who hopefully have been following the series.

17:31Unknownyeah, is that I think in people's minds they're like if I'm going to sit down and watch anything in the horror genre, I'm going to be uncomfortably scared and I'm not going to enjoy it.

17:40UnknownAnd they don't realize that those films are are one in a hundred. And there's so many genre films that although they they're about vampires or ghosts or whatever, they don't have to be terrifying.

17:52UnknownLike there's so much more going on in the genre and it isn't just about scaring people to such a point that it scares the shit out of them.

18:02LeeSo

18:02UnknownYeah, and and I still think I'm laughing because I know what Adam's going to say. Like it's tension that does it for me.

18:13AdamYeah. Yeah, cuz we watched off The Professional

18:18Adamand I absorb it by proxy. And sit there and relentlessly mock it, which I think is what it's there for. I think

18:25UnknownYes.

18:28Adambut yeah, the other day they were making like sugar sculptures, wasn't it? And things like And literally everyone's stuff was all falling to pieces and as they're going they go you got five minutes and people take things out the fridge and they're not done and everything and and so on and so forth.

18:45AdamAnd I swear to you the way Claire was carrying on, I said to her you've watched The Shining. You've watched let the right one in. You've watched

18:55ChrisYou should be able to handle

18:57AdamYeah. But this is what was doing that doing a really much more so than any film I could have shown. You were sort of can I bear it? They were just sucking fun

19:08ChrisToo real.

19:13UnknownBut it it is it's one of those tension is a very different thing I think to to horror. cuz I love horror, but I stopped watching

19:25UnknownBreaking Bad about three four episodes in the season two because I was coming home every day from work and we liked to come home and put something on and relax.

19:36UnknownAnd I was putting it on and it just made me tense for an hour and a quarter. And I was like yeah, but this isn't like all this is just a compelling story.

19:43ChrisNot fun.

19:45UnknownBut I just find it finishes and I'm I've got ad pain. It's like putting one of those electrocution things on. It just has me so on edge and so tight that like it's a great workout without having to leave the sofa, but I don't find it relaxing or enjoyable.

20:00UnknownLike it's just

20:01ChrisYeah.

20:01UnknownI think it also helps that like gore doesn't bother me at all. So cuz this film I forgot how gory it was. But yeah, gore doesn't bother me at all.

20:13UnknownSo that element of horror doesn't affect me.

20:18LeeYeah.

20:20UnknownBut yeah, no, I've I'm I'm enjoying watching loads of films I know nothing about. That that's fun.

20:27AdamAnd you're picking up favorites. You're you're you're a Vincent Price fan.

20:30UnknownI am. I'm a Christopher Lee fan.

20:32AdamYeah, we know.

20:33ChrisSee you are There's the thing. You are you are picking up on the right people. So you you know you do have an eye for it, I think.

20:41UnknownI love that era of television though as well. Like the '70s like Mission Impossible TV series Columbo, they're two of my all-time favorite things. And it's the same era.

20:53UnknownIt's that era of

20:54AdamThe same production era sort of yeah.

20:55UnknownYeah. That that I really dig.

20:59AdamAnd also the fact that I don't know 90% of any American '60s horror film I can show you it'll be like where do I know him from? Columbo.

21:09UnknownYes.

21:09ChrisYeah.

21:10AdamThey'll have been the villain.

21:11UnknownYeah.

21:11AdamVincent Price was in Columbo. He wasn't actually the murderer, was he?

21:14UnknownNo.

21:15AdamBut he's in Yeah. Which seems a bit of a waste, but also it's Vincent Price. If you make it I mean even though you know who's done it in Columbo, it would still be like if he walks into the room and he don't twig it's Vincent Price that's done it, you know, this

21:34Leeextra so Chris, have you seen anything in the last week?

21:38ChrisYes, I've continued my history of horror. So I think I've actually done the last one cuz I messed up the sequence. There might be one more after this, but this one was on monsters.

21:49ChrisSo you won't be surprised to hear that they covered Gremlins. They mentioned Krampus as well, which was pretty good. and of course the thing that was the two main ones that I saw.

22:03ChrisNow it was interesting Oh sorry, it was in fact the first one as well. So yeah, I thought it was kind of funny. Stephen King said kids are scared of clowns because he says he you know he gets abuse from clowns.

22:15ChrisBut you know kids are scared of clowns and they're disguised for what's really under there. You know that you shouldn't shoot the messenger just because he's passing on that information.

22:23ChrisSo yeah, so that that's really good. and then what they said about monsters are that they can do anything they want. They don't follow the rules. You know that a monster you can create a monster to do anything really.

22:36Chrisand so that can be what makes them really scary. loads of people had loads of love for Gremlins. someone said that when they went there they went there as a family and they thought it was going to be like ET.

22:48ChrisAnd it started off and it also had Steven Spielberg kind of a feel to it all. You know it's all like just a nice Christmas film. And then yeah, and then it all kicked off and it was like balls to the wall horror movie.

23:00ChrisWhat's going on? But it said yeah, it's just amazing. and it was interesting Joe Dante Dante said he grew up watching things like The Invisible Man because he said I don't know if he said people were confused, but it's the idea of just how funny it was and with the horror element to it was a bit unusual for some people, I think.

23:21Chrisand he said he loved the dichotomy of comedy. And as you've always said, you know the way comedy works is you're surprised or it's something you don't expect or you know and and the timing as well was really important.

23:33ChrisAnd so he just loves mixing the two.

23:35LeeAnd he he's one of the masters as well. Joe Dante is one of the best there is for mixing comedy and horror. Fantastic.

23:43ChrisDefinitely. Yeah, and he said it's funny the studio did not understand the film at all. You know when it was being made, didn't understand it when it was released, they didn't understand it.

23:50ChrisThey were just happy it made loads of money.

23:54ChrisBut yeah, and then yeah, so the thing tons of praise for that, you know, the way they the monster was different in every scene. So it was a change.

24:02ChrisYou know you hadn't really seen it before. And the fact that it's you don't know who it is. You know so just some great elements there. Eli even said it's the holy grail of horror movies.

24:12Chrisso he had a lot of love for it. And then they went on to Humans versus Nature. And they said The Birds was the first film to really do that.

24:21Chrisso it's kind of interesting to see that back in cuz I did watch that as a child. I think I mentioned before and it was that was one that when I left left the house, my friend's house, I was I remember just I ran so fast.

24:36ChrisLike the adrenaline just kicked in and I just saw a bird in the sky and it was like that was it. I was off. So I just remember the feeling of I did not expect to be this scared of birds after seeing that.

24:46ChrisObviously it faded by the next day, but still it was like just that yeah, I'd never thought that a bird would attack me before. And now, you know,

24:54UnknownYeah.

24:55Chrishappen. But yeah, so

24:58UnknownGreat to come out of the film with a new phobia.

25:00ChrisYeah.

25:03UnknownWell, thanks. It's been I saw a video of a seagull eat a whole rat. Mhm. No. fly into my life. Yeah. Holy shit. Yeah. In a high street. Yeah.

25:17UnknownWith people walking around it.

25:20ChrisLike is this because they're not getting as much food because people haven't been out as much?

25:24UnknownThere there distinctly is that, but I think I think it's also just there's a rat there and eating that. Just they are Yeah. That's that's something you saying about that.

25:34UnknownThat's something I do think we need to address at some point is we've not done a Hitchcock.

25:40ChrisMhm.

25:41UnknownAnd you know,

25:44ChrisThey do talk about his possible because you know, I hadn't heard this before, but they said the whole story is a woman who starts off and she's quite a liberal, strong woman who knows what she wants and like isn't afraid of anything.

26:02ChrisAnd then by the end she's a quivering wreck, which is what men want their housewives to be. And the actor, I've forgotten her name, said that she thinks Who was it?

26:13UnknownIs it Tippi Hedren in the Birds? I think it could be Tippi Hedren. Let me check. Yeah.

26:20ChrisAnd yeah, she said, you know, maybe Alfred Hitchcock had a bit too much going on in his life related to that perhaps.

26:29UnknownYes. I think I mean Hitchcock Hitchcock let it all hang out. And I can honestly I can honestly say and I don't think because I mean even if you get like later in his career

26:42ChrisOh, we're done.

26:43Unknownbut I think like later on in his career when like because I mean he was directing from the silent era. And He did that War film. What's that War thing he did?

26:56UnknownOh, the that was the that wasn't that the it wasn't the Holocaust one, was it? I think it was just was it the Holocaust one? It was. Yeah. Yeah.

27:04UnknownAnd he came in and like he was part of the production team of they did this film that was going to be demonstrating the Holocaust that was actually filmed at the time that they were liberating the camps just after the war.

27:18UnknownHoly shit. And and he was part of the team. He was like the sort of one of the unit directors and he was like part of the editing team of that.

27:26UnknownMhm. It's only been released 10 years. Yeah, I think it was like yes, it was a few years ago because it was like the sort of yeah, I think it was like sort of however took eight odd years since it had been first made and but they hadn't actually sort of finally put it together and got it released.

27:45UnknownSo I think it was because they were saying that people were watching the footage and everybody was so affected by the footage nobody could get through editing it together because there's just hundreds of hours Mhm.

27:58Unknownand no one wanted to do it. And I think and they said I don't, you know, there was a thing even though it was like a it was like a government sort of initiative that sort of started it off.

28:08UnknownThere was the element where it was like people probably won't want to see this. Mhm. That you know, people people were at least aware of what had gone on and had seen news footage and things like that and they were like is anyone going to want after all this is anyone going to sit down and watch two hours?

28:26UnknownYeah. You know, and it's which is, you know, it's it's a totally understandable thing. But I mean yes, I mean he was working from the silent era. And then by the time you get to Frenzy, which is sort of like early '70s, and that is pure early '70s.

28:43UnknownThat that that looks like most of how Theatre of Blood looks, but without the theatrical flourishes. So it's just a lot of grim London with people being grim. Mhm.

28:55UnknownYeah. And and it's basically it's a man going around strangling people with tires by strangling women with tires. And someone else gets accused of it. But by then it's really it's really quite sort of like seedy.

29:10UnknownMhm. And it's like and there is that element where it's like if Hitchcock was directing today, he would probably be like vilified out there. He'd be like doing the human centipede or something.

29:22UnknownHe would be or, you know, a Serbian film or something like that. You know, he'd be doing something really fucking well, really fucked up because he was. I mean it happened that he was very good at his craft, but yeah.

29:37ChrisIs that funny? Do you think that that did help it then?

29:41UnknownOh, undoubtedly. I think that his his own sort of like psychosexual weirdness certainly bleeds into the films. but also I think I mean he, you know, cuz I mean this the interesting thing is well if you watch something anything you watch of Hitchcock you suddenly go it's like oh yeah, no, I thought cuz we're watching an old film I'd sort of prepared myself.

30:08UnknownAnd then it's oh no, this is this is really fucking modern. Yeah. Yeah. You know, this still feels this is like I understand why this man is so influential because this is this is a blueprint of how cinema is now.

30:21UnknownYeah. And yeah, so I mean he's sort of cuz I mean you watch something like North by Northwest, which is a I was just about to say North by Northwest feels like a film that was made last year.

30:33UnknownYeah. Yeah. That that film is a George Clooney film from about 15 years ago. Yeah. Something like that where it's just like, you know, the man and the woman thrown together in odd circumstances.

30:50UnknownThey hate each other's guts, but you know, they're going to be boning. but and still be genuinely funny. It's like it's something it's a bit like with Bride of Frankenstein.

31:02UnknownYou know, where it still has funny elements that are meant to be funny and are funny rather than sort of like we have to make allowances for the time.

31:10UnknownThis was considered funny at the time because the man fell on his ass three times. And a trumpet went Whereas you sort of watch Hitchcock and it's like oh no, probably this could be you know, this could probably be a fairly successful film now.

31:28ChrisMhm.

31:28UnknownYou know, for sort of like two big name stars or something you can see it in that sort of right. That's a perfect segue into what I've have been watching this week.

31:36UnknownOh, have you watched So I have watched the Alfred Hitchcock Hour Sign of Satan episode with Christopher Lee. Oh, nice. so I've got a a book of horror stories with Christopher Lee doing the forward.

31:54Unknownand before each story he kind of says why he chose that story for the book. So he sort of edited it and introduced it. So oh, cool. Yeah. Yeah.

32:03Unknownyeah, and this so the short story he basically said, you know, I did this for the Alfred Hitchcock Hour. and it's one of my favourite things I ever did.

32:15UnknownOh, nice. So I managed to dig that out. I said I'd dig it out. It was on YouTube in its entirety.

32:24Unknownyeah, it's fantastic. Yeah. Really good. Feels really modern. It's it's got a really good not a twist to it, but it it's kind of it's it's Shadow of the Vampire before Shadow of the Vampire effectively.

32:40UnknownBut he isn't a vampire. He's an occultist. Oh, nice.

32:43UnknownSo he's in a story about a guy who takes part in a black mass and then it turns out he was actually the film was made by an occult group.

32:55UnknownAnd they just videoed a real black mass. yeah, and basically they're trying to track him down and kill him for releasing the video and stuff. Yeah, and it's really really good.

33:06UnknownReally ahead of its time. Really clever. Yeah. Nice. Well, it's 50 minutes long. It's brilliant. Yeah, I've got a lovely I've got a lovely book you got me of Alfred Hitchcock short stories and it's called stories they would let me do on TV.

33:27UnknownAnd it's all like the nastiest one that he wanted to put that he wanted to do on the Hitchcock Hour on Alfred Hitchcock Presents and stuff. And yeah, just like sort of 10 horror shorts, but they're really good.

33:43UnknownSounds good. I could dig that out. actually I watched I I've been reading a book this week. I haven't read a it's one of those books. I really enjoy it, but I'm going to do it in bits.

33:55UnknownMan, but it's actually Vincent Price book. Oh, nice. Yeah, that I got from previous guest on the show Sharon got me for a birthday. it's called The Book of Joe.

34:07UnknownAnd it's basically it's just a book written by Vincent Price about how much he fucking loves dogs. Oh, yes. He's just been talking about I love dogs because and it's just a full book of that.

34:19UnknownAnd it's so lovely. So I'm I'm using that as like a palate cleanser. So I've been a chapter of that and then I put a a horror book and then a chapter of that.

34:29UnknownAnd I always All the ways he loves dogs or is it all the dogs he loves? Well, so he's got a dog called Joe that he particularly loves. And the book is about him, but ultimately it's just about how much everybody loves dogs.

34:45UnknownSo they're like the first chapter is just about I went to a party once and someone had a dog. And that dog just completely ruled the party. It was a Hollywood party.

34:53UnknownIt was full of famous people. It was full of supermodels and coke-up actors. And as soon as somebody turned up with a Shih Tzu the entire party fell apart because everyone wanted to be within two foot of this dog.

35:07UnknownOh, right. Now this you can settle a bet here actually, you two. Oh. Adam said at his school it never a dog never ran on the playground and everyone lost their shit.

35:20UnknownAdam said he's never seen that in his life. I've heard I I know people have said about it before, but I don't It happened at our school at Saunders, no.

35:28UnknownIt never happened at Saunders. I remember at being in my junior school like a lot like at least once a month or so the dolphin come in everyone leave again

35:38ChrisThe same dog?

35:39Unknownbeen against the window and just go like like nobody had ever seen one before like it was snowing and we all live in Africa. Like the entire place filled with faces.

35:50UnknownYeah. It was just a dog running around in a field.

35:54ChrisI suppose it's like we all want to be out there running around in the field. That dog's getting to do it.

35:58UnknownHe's doing what we all want to do.

35:59ChrisYeah.

36:00UnknownYeah. Live our lives for us, you beautiful bastard. He's free.

36:08UnknownAnd that's all I remember is a black dog. So maybe it was one dog who regularly

36:12ChrisThe same one, yeah.

36:14UnknownIt's just a manifestation of your depression. That is also quite possible. I just love the idea of play from Black Beauty. No, what I've got in my head is the end where the chief runs off at the end of one flew over the cuckoo's nest.

36:30UnknownAnd like Christopher Lloyd's cheering and stuff like that as he escapes and yeah, that's all I'm thinking of is all the kids there sort of yes.

36:39ChrisYeah.

36:42UnknownOh, yeah. Apparently it still happens. Somebody asked Jennifer recently when we were discussing things that used to happen at school and do they still happen. Somebody did say do dogs still get in the field and kids lose their shit.

36:56UnknownAnd apparently kids are just as excited now as they ever were.

36:59ChrisThere you go.

37:00UnknownSo they've got the internet and they're still excited by the fact a dog gets into a field. Yeah, because he's an agent of chaos. He shouldn't be there. He's anarchy in fluffy coat.

37:16Unknownyes, so very quickly the other thing that I watched since the last episode I watched a film called Return of the Evil Dead which has nothing to do with the Evil Dead.

37:28Unknownand it's a Spanish film from 1973. It it's amazing. So the version I've got on DVD is dubbed. But it's a it's a a Spanish city where they murdered the Knights Templar because they were doing human sacrifices.

37:48Unknownand they burnt out the eyes of the Templars and then turned them at the stake. You Oh. Adam is looking so grim. Yeah, I'm just fucking jealous cuz that's one of the Blind Dead films.

38:00UnknownYes, yeah, it's also called Return of the Blind Dead. That's it. Yeah, cuz they there's like four of them. There's four in the there's four in the whole series, but they one of which is one of them's called Night of the Seagulls.

38:14UnknownOh, I watched that. There's there's not even any what's it called? It's not like they do two, three and four. They all have proper different titles. But there was a box set of it like ages ago and I didn't get it.

38:29UnknownAnd then there was an import box set of it and I didn't get it. And I'm just so pissed off because the Blind Dead films were like ones that I was I was a bit obsessed with.

38:39UnknownIt it was pretty much probably the only things I didn't catch on during the great wave the great wave of zombie like the great zombie revival. yeah, that was one of the few that I didn't sort of catch up on.

38:53UnknownAnd but yeah, sorry. Anyway, continue. But yeah, sorry. I realised you if you talk about Blind Dead and I got excited. And no, and you're quite right too because I saw it.

39:04UnknownI was like I I bought it a while ago and it's been on my shelf. I was like it's a Spanish movie. It's been dubbed. It's going to be a low budget movie.

39:12UnknownIt's going to be pretty crap, but it's going to be interesting. And it was absolutely amazing. really really enjoyed it. Like the the the the actual Knights Templar ghosts a skeletons in cowls and Knights Attire riding horses and just slaying people as they cry.

39:34UnknownIt's such an amazing visual and the story works really well. And Cuz they almost look like they're made of stone, don't they? Yes. Yes, they do. the the the effects on it is are really good.

39:46UnknownLike they look like skeletons despite the fact they move like people in costumes. And yeah, for '73 it looks absolutely fantastic. yeah, and I was really really surprised by how good it was.

40:02Unknownthe dialogue's a bit ropey because it's Spanish and it's been translated kind of poorly. Mhm. which kind of gave it an amusing edge but didn't take away from that cuz it it it kind of makes it amusing.

40:15UnknownAnd so when it's the boring talking bits you like that's not how you talk. And then all of a sudden the ghosts out and you go yeah, no, that's actually shit.

40:23UnknownScary like the previous. But yeah, it it ticks all the boxes. But I absolutely love the shit out of it. So Oh, well, the good news is there's three other films that you can catch up on.

40:34UnknownOne of them is already on the shelf waiting. So I'll be watching Night of the Seagulls, definitely now. Yeah. I don't know if any of them eat a rat but I've just sent them the link to it.

40:43UnknownOh, right. Okay. Yeah.

40:45ChrisI saw something pop up from you.

40:47UnknownOh yeah, no, I've just checked checked messaged you on Instagram so that you can like see. It is a thing.

40:54ChrisExcellent.

40:55UnknownI'm checking now as Your life would never be the same again.

41:02UnknownIt's nature red in tooth and claw. Yeah. Yes. Oh.

41:12UnknownHow does it make his throat do that? I don't know. It eats it like a lizard, doesn't it? Or a snake does.

41:17ChrisOh, yeah.

41:18UnknownYeah, that's proper man. That goes to show we should be scared of seagulls. I fucking am.

41:24ChrisYeah.

41:25UnknownAnything

41:29Unknownanywhere near me, thank you. Oh.

41:38UnknownYeah. Well done. Your life is different now. Thank you. Thank you later. Poor Chris he's just told you about his experiences as a child with the bird.

41:47ChrisOh no, that's it. It's all coming back.

41:49UnknownSorry. You can't leave the house without a tin hat and a fucking air rifle, man. Yes, sorry.

41:59Unknownright. So onto this evening's main topic. So yes, Theatre of Blood. Claire, before we delve into the movie, why did you choose this film? Like I said earlier, this era of TV and film I love.

42:18UnknownBut this film is so it's like it really is and it's not a horror comedy because it's not silly. Like it's not there aren't jokes in it. There are, but it it's really horrible.

42:36UnknownThe deaths are surprisingly grim and gory. but

42:46UnknownLionheart's disguises throughout the film get more and more ridiculous and in some cases quite racist. but they're just it's just great. And I have not seen any other horror film even Five that is like this one.

43:07UnknownYeah. It I don't think this genre happens now or would would be the same now. No. Because I think you need someone who's on the level of Vincent Price who has that authority.

43:24UnknownBut I believe in when I watch this film, I believe that Vincent Price can scale a building with Diana Rigg over his shoulder. I believe that he can survive a 5-foot fall and then drink meths and be fine.

43:38UnknownAnd like I believe he can fence. I believe he can do all these things. but at the same time it is it's a relatively easy watch. Yeah. Like there's no

43:52ChrisThanks thanks to him and his ability to

43:56UnknownYeah.

43:57ChrisJust yeah, act so well.

44:00UnknownExactly. And I would When did you work out that Diana Rigg was this ghost tube? Because I didn't work out for ages.

44:14UnknownIt's that it's funny you say that cuz yeah, I watched this with Jennifer. She didn't join us this evening cuz she cuz Claire's here. So she said, you know, if we have too many people it gets a bit.

44:25Unknownso she did watch the film cuz she loves it. But yeah, she kind of said the same. We were a little way in and she went oh, right. Well, I should have seen that earlier.

44:36UnknownIs she talking about the film or but yeah, and then I watched it was on about Diana Rigg. Yeah, the first time I watched it I think it took until you know, there's the flashback scene where you find out why Lionheart is killing them off.

44:53UnknownYeah. I think it took for her to appear in that scene for me to go oh, it's her. I think it took that long the first time I watched it.

45:06UnknownYeah. I think the first time I ever watched it I was I mean I don't know how old I was, but I definitely I don't think I saw it at all until it sort of got until the the reveal pretty much.

45:18UnknownYeah. Yeah. Cuz I don't I think it's also something that's different if you're familiar with Diana Rigg Mhm. possibly, which I wouldn't have necessarily like much I might have seen in Avengers.

45:31UnknownBut I wouldn't sort of I mean when I was watching it Vincent Price would have been the only person I recognised. Oh, and Captain Mannerly. Very, yeah. But the I mean even this watch I had to ask if her voice had been pitched down when she was being Has that man got a name?

45:49Unknownit's called the Stage Manager, but I prefer this ghost tube.

45:52ChrisOh, that's isn't that what he calls isn't that what Vincent Price calls him at one point?

45:56UnknownYeah.

45:57ChrisGo go and sort out the

45:58UnknownStage Manager.

46:02ChrisAnd yeah, I I did work it out. I can't remember exactly where. I don't know how far through, but like all the way through I was thinking there's something really weird about that person.

46:11ChrisObviously they are weird, but it's like okay. And then yeah, something did trigger it. I don't know exactly what it was.

46:17UnknownIs the disguise is the disguise of all time?

46:19ChrisYeah. Yeah.

46:24UnknownIt's probably quite helpful that it comes from a time where someone dressed like that would not be outlandish. I don't include I don't include Butch in that statement. Yeah.

46:33UnknownBut but just I mean you could imagine that person you would see you'd see that person in an in old news footage. Yeah. Or whoever it if it was if it was genuinely a male actor it's like oh yeah, he was in he was a grass in the Sweeney and he was in Yeah.

46:51Unknownyou know, like a Slade film or something like that. And someone I know dresses like that unironically because they're really cool. And I dressed like that now. Very similar hair and clothes.

47:08UnknownYeah, it's it's that The fact that Diana Rigg doesn't kind of play it overly butchly No. cuz she just kind of plays it. And and like you say '80s, you know, thugs in the Sweeney or Minder or whatever wouldn't be a million miles away from how she plays that character.

47:28UnknownSo it doesn't come off as outlandish or make you look any further than if somebody with a big perm, a big moustache and big glasses who's face you can't really see.

47:39UnknownAnd it isn't until you kind of put two and two together and you go oh shit, I've been watching the same person in two different roles for the last 50 minutes and I've not Yeah.

47:51UnknownI I think actually it's a tribute to the director because as well sort of watching it knowing that you realise quite how long it is before there's any real close-ups of that character.

48:07UnknownYeah. But equally it never feels like they're deliberately obscuring someone. Yeah. Do you know what I mean? It's not like you watch some things and like you say they're like you said, Chris, where it's like there's something up with that character.

48:20UnknownYeah. But it's never made a big enough deal of an issue

48:25ChrisYeah.

48:25Unknownthat it may be anything other than just henchmen. Yeah. You know. So yeah, well well done Douglas Hickox. And your directing style here. yeah, I just think this is such a cleverly put together film as well.

48:44Unknownit a lot of what we were saying before, although it's not full-out slapstick comedy, it's putting somebody like Eric Sykes in is in in a film of this kind of where it just kind of pays us along.

49:00UnknownIt doesn't go too much in the horror. It doesn't go too much into comedy. As you said Claire, it's got quite a lot of gore, but it never kind of goes excessive.

49:09UnknownYes, so having someone like Eric Sykes to to just kind of get the help get that balance right. Yeah, I think I think there was one joke at like actual joke that I had noticed.

49:21UnknownIt was the very end line about him exiting well well is a bit a bit melodramatic. Yeah. And even even he kind of even like the character in it kind of looks like the copper like what's the joke?

49:41UnknownYeah. What's the serious mate?

49:53UnknownIt's it's a man's died. Several men have died. Several women have died. You nearly had your eyes poked out by it. Yeah. Red hot swords. But so many of the characters in this are full caricatures like the one that stood out for me particularly was when you first see the I don't know how we're going to refer to them, the tramps or the wino's.

50:17UnknownThey call them meth drinkers in the Craig. he's in he's he's clearly a homeless man, but he's still wearing a three-piece suit and a top hat that's all crumpled and I was like why would people in the '70s still wearing crumpled Yeah, it's it's a bit think people were who were necessarily living in the sewers, but it kind of works in a kind of it's not it's not too overtly comedy, but you see what they're saying.

50:47UnknownIt it just But then there's another part where one of the when he's going into the fencing what would you call it? Fencing school. Fencing school. Yeah. And there's a tramp outside his blind selling matches.

51:03UnknownYeah. Like that that's a very Victorian Yeah. sort of image as well. But weirdly enough it's stuff that was still there in the '70s. Yeah. And I think and I think also the behaviour of the meth drinkers like when they're lying on the floor and one of them's just casually titting up really they're really really woman.

51:27UnknownYeah. Such a fantastic term. I know that actually Claire has brought that back into your repertoire recently titting up because I know that it's at one Would you like to clarify that?

51:40UnknownOnly because I once went to the cinema with Adam and he turned up and said Claire has specifically asked if if we sit in the back seat will you not tit me up while we watch the film?

51:52UnknownYeah. So I believe Claire you've brought us back into our circle of I'm bringing it back. Titting up. I'm bringing it back. dead one day she announced from from her podium.

52:08UnknownThat's me. But so you've got kind of they're really quite sort of sort of horrible, degraded sort of figures. Well we watched we watched it as well the commentary with the League of Gentlemen, which is brilliant.

52:25UnknownI definitely would recommend that as well. and Steve Pemberton says with the first killing the the one of the most horrible bit is they're all just kind of touching his face.

52:36UnknownYeah. Yeah. So I actually thought they might be zombies at that point. Yeah. It was very eerie. They they don't operate much above that sort of level within it in a weird way.

52:49UnknownYeah. No.

52:50UnknownAnd they were saying that that's really horrible. That's not particularly violent, but it's just gross. Yeah. Amongst It was that that first scene was great. I mean like at first it was like it was Michael Horden okay my eyes are wide.

53:04UnknownI'm watching Yeah. but yeah, it was just so good. Like really and yeah, and then throughout just everything was just so well dialogue fantastic, script fantastic. I forgot Michael Horden was in this actually and I was like yes, I've forgotten of whistle and I'll come to you.

53:26UnknownIt's because he's the first to go. So I don't weirdly because you never see him apart from in flashback. You never see him with the rest of the British circle.

53:35UnknownYeah. Whereas everyone else does get sort of their own bits in there. But I was both upset about that, but also because I know him as Gandalf from the radio adaptation of the Hobbit.

53:47UnknownWhat was it? Ring of Rings. Yeah. Yeah. and yeah, so it's like all right, if they're going to kill off Gandalf in the first scene, this has got to be a serious film coming up.

53:57UnknownWell the the league go on about the fact that when Michael Horden died the newspapers had put Paddington Bear man dies. Yeah. Just what they say as brutally like battered and knifed by the meth drinkers.

54:14UnknownBut I think actually and there's the there's that is like the whole of the critic circle are they've done very well in getting a lot of really good actors who for want of a better word it's not type casting, but they bring a baggage so you kind of fill in the blanks a bit.

54:36UnknownYeah. So Michael Horden is always very sort of particular

54:44Unknownand then so you've got that bit to him already and then it's like oh and he owns this property in London and he's and he would be he would be of a type where he feels well I'll just go in and I'll tell tell bugger off bloody And actually that's something that that came up is the league did mention that one of Michael Horden's lines was the first line is in the local shop.

55:15UnknownBecause Michael Horden once the once the meth drinkers start getting agitated he goes we'll have no trouble here. And not really. And so they said see it's not just a with Nick from other things as well.

55:28UnknownI'm I'm going to have to say it though amongst those meth drinkers one of them is the choreographer of that group. There's a guy called Tuty Lemko or Tuty Lemkov who did stuff like did Doctor Who sort of very early '60s Doctor Who would regularly turn up as parts, but also as a choreographer within the series.

55:53UnknownSo it was like he sort of had a a sort of twofold thing. And with this he is very much he was like the one who corralled the meth drinkers.

56:03UnknownAnd I think you know he's done such a good job with them and they're so like you say they're it's such a weird range considering they don't actually do or they don't seem to have any sort of exterior agency.

56:20UnknownThey just work as a mob. But again on the on the commentary they made a really good point of saying having that gang of people there, particularly in the wine tasting, you know where he gets drowned in the wine.

56:34UnknownThey do a really good job of you go well I'm not in danger because look at there's all these other people here. And so they do a really good job of just being like set pieces almost so that the the victims don't think that they're in trouble.

56:49UnknownMaking it seem normal. Yeah. Yeah. Because you've got a group Yeah, actually yeah, because you've got that group of people with you. Exactly. So you're immediately like well this is You're safe because who's going to do anything in a big group of people?

57:01UnknownThat's right. But it's but it's also the thing where they're like you say they are background to a lot of these people. So they're kind of like they are ignoring them.

57:09UnknownSo they're not like like at the wine tasting where they at every every time they every time it happens they gradually sort of break character for want of a better expression.

57:21UnknownYeah. It's like Lionheart's managed to sort of wind them up enough and then it's then the meth bottles are coming out and the bow ties have gone here and stuff like that.

57:31UnknownAnd it's like when they fit when when it's the this is your dish. Yes, that's right. Where one of where one of them's like passed out on the stairs.

57:43UnknownYeah. Even though even though Meredith Meredith is still under the impression he's being filmed, they've really sort of just lost it and just gone off and done their own thing and sort of played with a lock and If you look over the shoulder as well, so there's one passed out on the stairs and then literally as he realizes what's happening and he stands up and walks forward from the table, one of them lurches behind him, picks up the bottle of wine he'd been drinking and just starts chugging it.

58:12UnknownSo he's like he's beyond help. I'm drinking this. Yeah. Like he's just genius. They are they are best background actors I've possibly ever seen. They're absolutely fantastic. I think that Tuty Lemko is the guy who is passed out on the stairs in that sequence.

58:32UnknownBut amongst other people you've got in there, one of them is the original Bungle from Rainbow. What? Who who did Lion Where is it? guy called Stanley Bates who did 920 episodes of Rainbow.

58:46UnknownHoly shit. And he's one of them, but also one of them is a guy called Declan Mulholland and he's the really he's the biggest one like the big fat guy.

58:55UnknownYeah. and he is the human Jabba the Hutt. You know before they they changed it. Yeah. They they they changed it. Yeah. He's just this big Scottish bloke you know like an Afghan copper.

59:07UnknownYeah. Excellent. And but and he's been in he's been in he's been in Doctor Who. He's in Hawk the Slayer. He's also the ruling class, but I'll come back to that because that's something that a lot of people in this have appeared in.

59:23UnknownSo And Jennifer noticed as well. So Joan Hickson was in this as a very small role. she was Miss Marple. Yes, Miss Marple. Yes, yeah, Miss Marple. Yeah, she was Sprout's wife.

59:37UnknownYeah. Yeah. Literally just in that scene where they're in bed and she keeps telling him to stop snoring and stop being a And then wakes up next to his decapitated corpse.

59:48UnknownSee I think that's the first killing that isn't that there's comedy in it. I was Yeah. Like when he's when he is going basin basin and then he goes ugh and rolls his eyes.

1:00:00UnknownThat's when you can feel a real father-daughter dynamic of oh 'cause she never does this, but you can She's forgotten the fucking bowl again. Yeah. jabbing her in the ass with the aesthetic over and over again.

1:00:17UnknownAnd even the comedy oh when she gets Yeah. When he when she gets this with Sharine and oh Yeah. And also him muttering in his

1:00:29Unknownby the way Lee that bit is filmed in Oakley Court. Is it really? Yeah. Oh. 'Cause the entire film and I think this definitely helps, the entire film is filmed on location.

1:00:41UnknownThere's not a single set in this. It's just I mean obviously like a lot of the derelict stuff It's like they it doesn't feel like a sound stage. It all feels like real genuine built into places.

1:00:56UnknownYeah. Yeah, which definitely makes a massive difference, especially for the the central London stuff as well. But that guy's house where you can see the London Bridge arch Yeah.

1:01:10Unknownjust in the window. I was like can you even imagine how much it must have cost him to have shot This is exactly what we were going just like how much that must cost now like then, but now I don't even think it you you could afford it as a residential place.

1:01:27UnknownNo. You're probably right. It probably is someone's offices now. It's got to be. If it's still there 'cause a lot a lot of the derelict stuff's gone. the actual theatre where they film it like the that like his lair Yeah.

1:01:42UnknownYeah. Lionheart's lair like that. that is I think it's the I think it's the Bermondsey Hippodrome which had been derelict which had been like closed for about 14 years before the film was shot.

1:02:00UnknownAnd they basically rented it off the current owners for like I think like a packet of crisps and a bottle bottle of Jack Daniels or whatever like that

1:02:14UnknownAnd and so yeah, that and that's that place had been like basically left to rot for the best part of 15 years. And they went in there and just got to use it.

1:02:26UnknownBut also the building was scheduled for to be condemned. So when they set fire to the place, they set fire to the place. Yeah, I was wondering. This is And I'll tell you what, fucking Vincent Price cannot fucking whack a bloody torch when he up into the royal box.

1:02:41UnknownYeah.

1:02:45UnknownYeah, I've got a note here Yeah, exactly. One throw with one and he's got two torches and he just turned around and just lobbed one straight into the box and I was like you know what, I'd have done this film for free to be able to go into the theatre and lob burning torches around the way he does because he looks like he's having a fucking whale of a time.

1:03:04UnknownBut doesn't that show what a good actor he is that he didn't do it and go fucking hell did you see

1:03:12UnknownYeah. 'Cause I mean you give give me two burning torches and a cape, I will be on fire before I've managed to torch any of that fucking building 'cause I'm an idiot.

1:03:23UnknownBut yeah, and but again it's sort of like it's just perfectly right because it's that sort of because it's clearly like glamour. It was clearly sort of like quite a prestigious sort of theatre and it's just they've had the luck to go in and it's just been their set designer has been 15 years of neglect that has just made it sort of right.

1:03:46UnknownAnd also Yeah. Looks incre It does look incredible. It's just the perfect set for and and you saying about Vincent Price as well. I I think that's one of the things that can't be swept under the carpet.

1:03:59UnknownNobody could have played this part but Vincent Price. Like just the right level of when he needs to be a good actor because he's pretending not to act he's perfect.

1:04:11UnknownAnd then when you want someone to be the hammiest actor of all hammy actors. He's all over that. He can do it. Yeah. But also the fact that he kind of he manages to combine the two in so much as there are bits where he's doing the Shakespeare and it's Lionheart feeling it.

1:04:33UnknownYeah. Like he's doing especially when it's like the soliloquy from Hamlet, which is weird because obviously you've got all the murders that are in there, but then you've got sort of bits and pieces like there's the Brave New World that has what what people in it what creatures in it, which comes from the Tempest and again it's about being washed up on an island.

1:04:51UnknownSo that's when he And similarly with that where he does like the Hamlet soliloquy and it's like actually he's really fucking good Yeah. and would be you know if this was in context, you'd be going he's fucking good Hamlet.

1:05:04UnknownYeah. 'Cause that's that's I'm saying that that that point I felt the bit where he's doing the to be or not to be and all the critics are inside going look at him out there.

1:05:19UnknownI felt really really sad for Lionheart because you could tell he was just genuinely gutted that no they hadn't made a mistake. They all genuinely didn't think he was good enough.

1:05:30UnknownYeah. And he was just absolutely gutted. And I felt I was like oh And and you feel sorry you feel sorry for Diana Rigg as well because it's like don't let them get to you.

1:05:43UnknownYeah. Don't don't give them this opportunity to mock you further. They've already they've already destroyed you essentially, but don't give them this to sort of like amuse them. No.

1:05:54UnknownDiana Rigg is again fantastically casting this because as you say when she play when she plays the the heavy with the big moustache, she kind of doesn't overplay it enough that you suddenly go that's a woman pretending to be a man in a very obvious way.

1:06:15Unknownbut again she she plays the daughter so kind of empathetically and so genuinely. And and and Diana Rigg I I've always thought such a underplayed actress. Yeah. Yeah. See I I didn't know her until Game of Thrones.

1:06:33UnknownSo that's that's the only thing I'd seen her in. And Yeah. And and in that she certainly appears to have a slightly cheeky aspect to her which suits this as well.

1:06:44UnknownSo it's like yeah, She's really she really is quite

1:06:52Unknownshe's a playful old woman Game of Thrones. She's just mischievous like Nans should be. Yeah. But in the sort of sense of well I've been round the fucking block a few times before any of you So here's a poison for you nasty little Nans boy.

1:07:09UnknownAnd so on and so forth. And it's yeah. But I mean obviously she did the Avengers where she was Emma Peel. And interestingly enough the Avengers started off and it's it was it's always been John Steed's like Patrick Macnee in the bowler hat and the cane and like the umbrella with the sword.

1:07:31Unknownbut obviously they had different people as they went along, but the very first person it was actually 'cause it famously it's always like him and a woman. But the very first version of the Avengers it's a guy called Doctor David Keel who is played by Ian Hendry who is Devlin in this.

1:07:52UnknownSo he sort of kicked off he kicked off being in the Avengers and then Diana Rigg came in after like he was replaced by Honor Blackman and then Honor Blackman was replaced by Diana Rigg.

1:08:04UnknownSo again there's a lot I mean obviously it's it's Britain in the '70s. So obviously the actors tend to sort of have been in bits and pieces the same as well.

1:08:17UnknownIt's worth noting that

1:08:21UnknownDiana Rigg's daughter is an actress called Rachel Stirling. And they played mother and daughter in the Crimson Horror, which is a Mark Gatiss episode of Doctor Who. And they played mother and daughter in the Detectorists, that Toby Jones sitcom.

1:08:40Unknownand she's in On Her Majesty's Secret Service. as the only woman who marries Bond. And then gets shot for her trouble. Spoiler alert it's been out for fucking years.

1:08:54Unknownone worth checking out Lee is the Assassination Bureau, which is a film she's in with Ollie Reed and Telly Savalas. And it's kind of like a bit of a priest thing, punk thing, punk sort of 1920s adventure sort of thing like Edwardian era of things.

1:09:12UnknownIt's pretty good and very the Assassination Bureau. It's not much of an Assassination Bureau, is it?

1:09:23UnknownI should look that up. But yeah, that's that's definitely worth that's definitely worth checking out. Obviously we've covered Mr. Price on three separate occasions before this. Tales of Terror, House on Haunted Hill and the Abominable Doctor Phibes.

1:09:40UnknownSo yeah. Put that in your pipe and smoke it mate. Thank you. Yeah. Also Chris do you remember Diana Rigg was also in the Worst Witch? She played Miss Hardbroom.

1:09:53UnknownYes. Oh. Yeah. Didn't realize that. Okay. Oh I never saw Avengers as a kid, the Avengers. So that's what I always remember as was Mrs. Hardbroom. And obviously it's it's a very small role, but it was always what I It left a big impression on you.

1:10:11UnknownYeah. Mostly.

1:10:17UnknownBut and actually Diana Rigg ended up setting up the actress in Coral Brown who plays Chloe Moon, the critic who is burnt like like electrocuted by the hairdressers. apparently she heard Vincent Price no she Diana Rigg was a a like gone to the theatre and this and Coral Brown was also there.

1:10:44UnknownAnd apparently she overheard her in the toilet saying I fancy Vincent Price. I really fancy and basically set them up. And yeah, and she became Vincent Price's wife. Aww.

1:10:59UnknownWell it's not quite so I think Vincent was on his second wife when he met her. So it's not Oh yeah, that maybe not. And that was like Vincent Price's like third and and final wife.

1:11:10UnknownHe was with her till she died. but yeah, so Diana Rigg who set them up because it was like well you know she obviously fancies Mr. Price. So That's it.

1:11:22UnknownWho doesn't? Well Exactly. It's got to be said. I mean he's he's a man of many talents. Well I have got an ask welcome to horror actually. Oh. Actually.

1:11:36UnknownActually I've got an ask welcome to horror actually. Actually. And what is your favourite? What do you think is the best slash your favourite disguise that Lionheart uses in this film?

1:11:51UnknownThat's a very good question. Chris would you like to answer this first? Yeah, well so you might say this is a bit of a cheat, but I did like him when he was dressed with his cape at the awards ceremony, but of course that's not really a disguise.

1:12:07UnknownBut it's because every time I saw a scene with his with a new costume on, it was like well that one's great, but what's the next one going to be?

1:12:16UnknownAnd so by the end I was like oh what were they all again? So I'll need to watch it again to remind myself of exactly how he looked. But then we were saying watching it when when he's in the theatre with his cape on any you could pause think that scene at any point and that should post it for the film.

1:12:33UnknownYeah. Yeah, but when he's on the throne He paused that off so well. standing next to him and the torches and yeah, everything every single bit. Yeah. And in fact I think the the DVD that I used to have a bit the front cover was just him in the sort of in the dinner jacket and cape.

1:12:51UnknownYeah. I don't think they sort of really went for anything other than that. Don't need to. My favourite is when he's dressed. Apparently he's dressed as Achilles when he You know when it's the second murder when he comes down in the crow mask.

1:13:09UnknownYeah. But it's more when he takes it off, he looks like fucking Arthur Brown. Yeah. When I saw Arthur Brown like this sort of like crazy old man in essentially wartime, Yeah.

1:13:22Unknownyou know, and yeah, so there's that. But I love the fact that he's sort of sitting there and it's it's a bit like that thing he used to get on Big Brother, which is have a fancy dress party and we'll give you loads of booze.

1:13:35UnknownAnd then someone dressed like a fucking caveman is having an argument with a bumblebee in the garden quite deliriously. Yeah.

1:13:44UnknownAnd everyone has to stand around looking awkward while two people dressed as That is not just Big Brother. That is Halloween on any British high street. Oh yeah, yeah.

1:13:54UnknownVery true. But I do like that fact that he's sort of he's dressed like he's dressed like Peter Gabriel in Genesis. Yeah. But he's just sat dejected in a chair and just sort of like saying, well you did see that, but what else did you say?

1:14:10UnknownAnd he's just really winding up to the point.

1:14:16UnknownI I think for me it's got to be the very first point at which we see him in the film, which is where Michael Holden is taken into the building and there's the coppers on either side of the door.

1:14:28UnknownIt's the police. Yeah. and it it's obviously Diana Rigg and Vincent Price, as we find out later, with those massive porn stashes. Yeah. Yeah. He walks through the door, they turn and walk in after him and I was like, he's going to get fucked.

1:14:44UnknownYeah. They're they're going to go in, he's going to offer to fix the piano. It it's all going to turn into Yeah, so I think that's my favourite is him dressed up as a policeman with big glasses on and a massive moustache that just sat between his cape and his hat.

1:15:01UnknownSo I thought that was awesome. Yeah. Again, that's another bit where the director does some marvellous misdirection by not making a big thing of anything. So if you were watching it or you're watching it casually or you're not quite concentrating or you know, you just got It's like, oh yeah, there's like there's two you know, bit part actors who are playing the coppers.

1:15:24UnknownYeah, there's two foot part different. Don't worry about that. Yeah. But for me, because I was looking and like and I think this is probably the first time I've noticed off the bat, yeah, that it's them straight away.

1:15:37UnknownBut only because yeah, this probably I saw the fifth time of seeing this film. So I was watching for them the whole time in the background. So as soon as you see two coppers who are kind of hiding their faces in massive moustaches, I was like, there they are straight away.

1:15:55UnknownI I got to say I loved the question, especially if being asked before watching the film, like cuz I don't think we've done that sort of thing before cuz it was like, oh that gives me such a good hint as to what to expect.

1:16:06UnknownWell like you said But it doesn't give it away. When when we were watching it, you didn't go, oh that's my favourite. Oh no no no, that's my No no no, that's my favourite.

1:16:12UnknownYeah. Like what's going to come next. Yeah. Cuz I love Butch. Everything about It's so like off the era. It's so different to any of the others because it looks like Vincent Price.

1:16:31UnknownThere's no disguise. He's just got a shirt with two naked men on and an afro. But the fact that he's being so like overtly camp Yeah. is enough that makes everybody not want to look.

1:16:46UnknownYeah. Because at that time like, oh no I don't want to Like the the copper is clearly freaked out where he keeps pisses at him and sort of Yeah, he's like, no don't look.

1:16:54UnknownAnd he's like, no no no, bump me. Yeah. But that's why it's so perfect, as you say, because of you know, in that era you know, like now you'd be like you know, you'd be kind of presumably, I'm sure most people would be kind of flattered and in no way terrified by the fact that if you're a man, a man fancies you, it doesn't mean he's going to necessarily try and attack you.

1:17:18UnknownBut the fact that the copper is like, I should be protecting that person, But but there's another man down there who might fancy me. I couldn't possibly go down there cuz who knows what might happen.

1:17:29UnknownJust by the way of the policeman and he's obviously and yeah, it is that and that level of fear, which is ridiculous. Yeah. It was 1973, you could catch gay off a chair.

1:17:43UnknownVery careful. I mean, look at that other that other critic with his two dogs. I mean, you never see but Old macho man Meredith Meredith yes. See now this is the first time I picked up on the fact that in the it in the the original story yeah, they did say it's a queen who is forced to eat her Now I never picked up on that necessarily before.

1:18:12Unknownbut yeah, again it it's off that era where it isn't necessarily offensive then I don't think it should be now when you look back at stuff necessarily. I think it's done I think it's done with a level of it's there's enough comic effect to it that it it's kind of cuz I think it's probably also because it's it speaks more to Lionheart's cruelty or the sense of humour but it 's like sort of like oh the queen who ate her babies.

1:18:47UnknownI think also probably feeding someone their actual babies is not right for this film. No. It would be completely just like the wrong thing to do. Yeah, if he if Yeah, you if he'd fed someone their children.

1:19:00UnknownYeah. But feeding someone their poodles is funny. Yeah. Yeah. Exactly. Even though that's possibly the one death that I think that's the one that I think feels personally feels the is just the idea of being choked to death with like food is Chicken tonight.

1:19:19UnknownYeah, as it is yeah.

1:19:23UnknownBut I think I think if we if obviously cuz unlike fives, I mean obviously fives is the thing that this shares a lot of DNA with. Yeah. Yeah. And actually it's got the same It's probably the same thing the reason why fives works is the reason why this works is the reason why seven works is cuz you've given yourself a structure.

1:19:43UnknownYeah. And it's like so you know that it's like it's like a greatest hits package almost cuz it's like right, I know that in 15 minutes there'll be another murder and there'll be another.

1:19:56UnknownBut also you go into the sort of thing of well if they're doing this, will they do you know, if they're doing Shakespeare, will they do this one? And similarly like how do you work the seven deadly sins or Oh it's funny because the police also know that and they do fuck all except great that plot grapes.

1:20:13UnknownYeah, yeah. Yeah. Again, funny coppers of film land. Yeah. Or the writer The first said the same. So we've obviously that amazing cameo It's quite a cameo but Diana Dors Yes.

1:20:31UnknownThey'd worked out by that point what it was, you know, what the what the sequence was. It was Othello yeah. So they knew it was Othello, they knew he was presumably going to be the next one.

1:20:42UnknownAnd so the fact that he still went and murdered her, you know, well you must be one step ahead surely by that point but Yeah.

1:20:52UnknownWe laughed so much when when Lionheart comes out just goes, oh he's done a murder in there and walks off. No, I think it's said with some sort of the most extraordinary Scottish accent.

1:21:05UnknownI think he's away murdering his wife up there. Yeah, and then just Meredith said the same. Not wait here, didn't handcuff him to the thing. Yeah. Went up there and left him behind to wander off across St.

1:21:17UnknownJames's Park. Yeah. He actually The copper actually goes, oh thank you sir. Thank you. The same And I think it's exactly the same way as if you said to someone if you said to him, they've just opened our digestives in there.

1:21:31UnknownThank you. going spare in there. Oh, thank you sir. You know. But I think and weirdly enough fives obviously we we did fives and we know that it's not quite the the plagues of the Pharaohs.

1:21:47UnknownIt's kind of an adapted version of it whereas this actually sticks quite properly to the text of its age. Although obviously you've got stuff like Merchant of Venice is cuz even that's what Devlin says, only Lionheart would have the temerity to rewrite Shakespeare.

1:22:04UnknownRewrite it Yeah, yeah. Cuz it's like, oh there's Merchant of Venice, there's no murdering that is there. And then the best bit is is that they do when when it gets to Titus Andronicus, I'm really I love Devlin sort of skims over it a bit.

1:22:19UnknownBut Titus Andronicus is fucking bodies walls to wall. So that would have been like I have no fucking idea which one he's going to go for out of this cuz it's a big fucking list.

1:22:30UnknownBut I think cuz obviously so they kill George Maxwell, Michael Hordern gets killed. It's Julius Caesar. Yeah. Cuz in that Caesar is killed by the Senate conspirators, which is represented by the the thingy Then you've got Troilus and Cressida with Hector Snipes, who's Dennis Price.

1:22:51UnknownNow Dennis Price did a film called Kind Hearts and Coronets, which kind of is in a similar vein. Okay. It Well it's kind of in a similar vein. It's basically it's a black comedy in which someone's bumping off members of the family so that they get the inheritance.

1:23:06UnknownBut the interesting thing is Dennis Price is like the illegitimate child and the entire rest of the family are all played by Alec Guinness. But Alec Guinness plays I think it's like nine characters in it.

1:23:20UnknownThat's great. Yeah, and it's just And it's it's an old like it's an old Ealing one. It's like an old Ealing comedy. And yeah, Alec Guinness is basically like he's the old dowager.

1:23:31UnknownHe's the the uncle who's a boat captain and stuff like that. And it's that's really worth checking out. I think I got to see that. Yeah, cuz Dennis Dennis Price sort of a big He was quite a big actor at the sort of at the time.

1:23:47Unknownhe's in Dr. Frankenstein He played Dr. Frankenstein rather for the Jess Franco films Dracula, Prisoner of Frankenstein, and The Erotic Rites of Frankenstein. He's in Twins of Evil and he's in The Horror of Frankenstein, like the Hammer films.

1:24:05UnknownYeah. And but he's in He's in a film called Horror Hospital and by the end he's getting sort of like this is probably like the classiest role he got towards the end of his career.

1:24:17UnknownCuz he was almost like a matinee idol like back in the day. and then yeah, he's in Horror Hospital, which is the Michael Gough film, and he plays like this needlessly CD gay travel agent basically.

1:24:35UnknownAnd it's sort of like And to the point where it's like, oh they're setting him up to be a villain and he isn't really. It's just a cameo but he's just an unpleasant prick.

1:24:43UnknownIt 's like sort of Yeah. He did He didn't get sort of like some great stuff there. But that with the stab with the spear, body dragged away by a horse as happens in Troilus and Cressida, that's horrible.

1:24:58UnknownThat When they turn him over with gravel, it bedded in place. Yeah. It looks so horrific.

1:25:07UnknownAlthough I would like to go on a Lionheart style sort of killing spree of faking death and going on a killing spree but I want to do all the It's more the bits like where he's the gravedigger.

1:25:17UnknownAnd it 's like Yeah. Why not show yourself to what? Nine people who could potentially recognise you and the police. Sort of You It's a bit But he's that good of an actor I think.

1:25:31UnknownThat's That's a He is that good of an actor. He is Vincent Price. They did They The league do say on their commentary that it 's like, well if the acting wasn't working out, he could turn his hand to surgeon, hairdresser, massage graphic designer.

1:25:49UnknownBecause those massive masks at the end of the critics, you know, like the giant faces Yeah, so cold. They are brilliant. And again it's like that again where the meth drinkers have been brought in and they're they're sort of going along with it but then when And fair play to Devlin, how far do you fucking take something?

1:26:11UnknownYeah. Every every single other person pretty much goes, it was Devlin, it wasn't me. I wanted George to be King of the World. and he's the only one who's like, no I refuse to give you the best actor award because whatever his name is that Bob Woodstock or something like William Woodstock or whatever, who you never see.

1:26:29UnknownYeah. Yeah, I did wonder. I was thinking is he going to turn up? Doesn't love boy. See and this is the point at which I screamed at the screen and Adam will appreciate it.

1:26:40UnknownHe does say never ever ever and I followed it up with bloody any anything ever. Bloody anything ever. Now you had a bet on what you thought it was like.

1:26:52UnknownWell well we'll come We'll We'll be coming to that as well cuz cuz you got Arthur Then Then obviously there's Arthur Lowe, Captain Mainwaring, Voice of the Mister Men, the Mick Travis trilogy for Lindsay Anderson.

1:27:05UnknownAnd again he brings that sort of pomposity but like Mainwaring is henpecked. Yeah. And that's clearly his role within it is that cuz they the critics circle they're like sort of going to him, well your wife's going to pick you up and you want to get started cuz your wife's going to pick you up in half an hour and you come

1:27:26UnknownEspecially when he's just it's just the Well meet in the morning, move the move the move the thing in the morning. Yeah. And he said yes dear.

1:27:36Unknownand yeah, obviously decapitated in his sleep which is the same thing. Someone actually gets decapitated in a fight in Syme Lane and then they lay him next to his lover.

1:27:52UnknownBut here's a question. How did his head get from the floor Get to Yeah, the milk bottle. Yeah. They've obviously had to hang around. I love the idea that Vincent Price had one disguise we don't see.

1:28:05UnknownHe might have popped back in the box. He was No, he's the milkman as well.

1:28:12UnknownMilk so goes. You know, doing his So I reckon he's turned that whistly whistly, clanky clanky.

1:28:25UnknownThen Drink a pint of milk a day. Meredith followers who get that. Yeah. And then you get I mean again the the names are incredible because it's it's very Dickensian.

1:28:42UnknownYou know where it's like sort of Miss Lovely and Mister Bastard. Yeah, that's that's how Dickens writes a book, you know. Yeah. And then you've got Trevor Dickman,

1:28:54Unknownseduced away with his grotty little zodiac sign. You said it's like

1:29:04UnknownOh no, everything about it is horrible. Especially because it's like Diana Rigg in in thigh-high boot, knee-high boots, and a miniskirt comes up to you and you've you've got that looking in the mirror every day and you've just thought, yeah.

1:29:21UnknownYeah. Of course she wants me. is after me clearly. That's one of my great That's one of my favourite Diana Rigg moments in the whole film is when they're walking away and he goes to grab her on the bum and she notices and just grabs his hand and holds it.

1:29:37UnknownAnd I just love that when she's like, no you've already touched me up in the cab. Yeah. We kind of had the same conversation because But he Jennifer was like, what really this whole old man And I was like, yeah but it it's like the the kind the on the buses thing which we've discussed before, where you'd have men in their forties, possibly their fifties, who were bus drivers and conductors and then you would have the clippy girls, who were all 18 to 21 falling about and fighting each other over getting their hands on these 50-year-old men.

1:30:14UnknownLike it's it's just Let me let me just interject here as as a woman myself. Yes. I'm going to get all of it right on here but as TV then and now still is run, the high up guys are still majority men.

1:30:34UnknownYeah. What does a 50-year-old man want? Oh, wouldn't it be nice if instead of my 50-year-old wife at home, you know, I reckon I could get one of these girls, one of these young girls.

1:30:45UnknownI've got 50-year-old girls in a miniskirt cannot wait to get hands on me. Exactly. I I think that what rough draw like each You know the word You know the word that's missing from this conversation.

1:30:59UnknownDolly Bird. Oh. That's how they would be referred to. It's like, well I reckon I could stab Richard and one of these dolly birds so why not Reg Varney?

1:31:06UnknownYeah, cuz

1:31:09UnknownWhat more is she then a pair of go-go boots and red lipstick? And that's And that's right and that is what was happening in British TV at this time but I've just never I've never been able to get my head around how people didn't just go, what?

1:31:30UnknownWhat? No, why is anybody watching on the buses? It is the most A it isn't funny. I mean I know a comedy would have was you know, of a different ilk back then.

1:31:42UnknownBut yeah, and and it just makes it so unbelievably ridiculous. I just don't Well it's where again talking like like we lost souls, it's where Austin Powers' bad teeth came from.

1:31:55UnknownIs Mike Michael Michael Myers fuck sake. Mike Myers Yeah. But Mike Myers like lived over here a lot like when he was a kid. And he watched on the buses and it was Jackanory on the buses was always like always got the bird.

1:32:13UnknownYou know, Reg Varney had been sort of like a bit but he was no matter what he always he always scored. And he looked like an animated coconut scarecrow.

1:32:25UnknownI was just a wizened wooden head with teeth like a poorly maintained cemetery. Hair like Jimmy Savile in the rhyme. Lovely. And it's like yeah, and it But he always scored so it's like We've hot I can see your old women in short skirts and knee-high boots.

1:32:42UnknownYeah. I guess it's Yeah, I guess it is what was happening in TV and movies at the time but yeah, I I just Yeah. It's really

1:32:57UnknownBut then I think this movie knows it. Oh yeah, yeah yeah. It's like You know, how how did you How did you snare various people? How did you snare them?

1:33:05UnknownIt's like sort of like oh one of them we con we conned him cuz obviously they get Hector Snight in saying, oh Lionheart's alive and he wants you to write a biography of him.

1:33:17UnknownSo he's like, well of course you would ask me cuz I'm bloody lovely and amazing like that. Michael Hordern they play on his sort of authoritative greed essentially. And then and like But yeah, Trevor Dickman it's just like, what are you going to do?

1:33:34UnknownI'll send Diana Rigg because he's a walking hard-on. Yeah. And you know, He's a devil. We'll send a a girl who's 50 years too much too young for him and he'll be all over that shit.

1:33:47UnknownYeah. But the guy who plays Trevor Dickman is Harry Andrews who is the voice of General Woundwort in Watership Down. So there you go. and he's in He was in The Michael Caine Jack the Ripper.

1:34:02UnknownHe's in Return of Sherlock Holmes. He's in The Second Stain. So you would have recently. Again coming back to it, he's the 13th Earl of Gurney in the ruling class.

1:34:12UnknownHe's in The Ruling Class. A lot of people in this are in The Ruling Class and frankly more people should know that. he's in Superman The Magician Touch. So he's he sort of does He He He's around a lot but then obviously so they rewrite The Merchant of Venice cuz the whole point at the end of Merchant of Venice is you've demanded a pound of flesh but literally you've cooked flesh.

1:34:33UnknownSo you can't have blood. You can't have And that's how they get out of the clauses, like how Porsha gets gets in free from the clauses. Whereas I'm very much with Lionheart where it's like, well this is a court of law and yes, that would be terrible if I did that.

1:34:50UnknownI'm still having my pound of flesh. I'd have been able to vegetable peeler. I'd have had the prick from skin from top to toe. It would be the itchiest four fucking weeks of all time.

1:35:00UnknownYeah. Yeah, cuz I'd I'd have just skinned off. So right, you don't want any blood. Okay, right give me vegetable peeler. Give me vegetable peeler. That's what I'm having.

1:35:12UnknownSo yeah, so Dickman gets done and then you've got Richard the Third drowned in a butt of Malmsey wine. I always wanted to do that with someone. That's nose he's got in that character as well with Like his his portrayal and his outfit is pretty amazing but that nose is absolutely ridiculous.

1:35:33UnknownYeah. Especially I wish somebody with a nose like that even ate. In the way of his mouth it's Cuz I think that's the thing as well it it almost feels like they've sat there and gone the Merchant of Venice, especially portrayals of Shylock, are you know, often and certainly at the time would have been ludicrously anti-Semitic Yeah.

1:35:59Unknownin terms of let's make him a real stereotypical Jew. So it almost feels like they've done Richard the Third and it's like, right give him a bigger fucking nose than you gave him when he was Shylock to prove that this production doesn't agree with that.

1:36:13UnknownBecause I mean he's he's in there, yeah. It's you know. But yeah, I mean frankly you say to Dean, I'm going to drown you in a butt of wine.

1:36:23UnknownHe's happy. You know, he's he's what he would have wanted. So apparently a butt prove of Mumsy wine is a vat of 477 L. Wow. I am so fascinated I know.

1:36:37UnknownThank you. I've got you in store here. So yeah so that's what nine So yes so that's the that's the time. 50 bottles. Yeah. So that's that's a lot of Nice.

1:36:51UnknownExpensive death. I thought that myself as well when they put him in I was like where where has he got that much money from when he was like oh yeah this is a decent vintage and I was like what a barrel of a decent vintage I can't Unless it wasn't by that time he was so drunk.

1:37:10UnknownYeah. If also you're judging it by the colour of that wine it's that three bottles of wine and the rest of it's

1:37:23UnknownNow here comes the here comes the true test I think for Lee. Oh. This this is it. So then you get murder 5A that isn't a murder. Which is you get Devlin and Lionheart fencing.

1:37:41UnknownYes. And that is based on Romeo and Juliet and it is the fight between Romeo and the fiery Tybalt. warlike Tybalt. Fiery warlike Tybalt. So Tibs while I finish my speech he's all right.

1:38:00UnknownEdward this is Shakespeare. Everyone knows that Shakespeare crap. Although well yes it is but no. And yeah so by filthy rich and Catflap we cannot in any way take Shakespeare It's actually written in my notes.

1:38:21UnknownThird to It's written in my notes the fiery warlike Tybalts.

1:38:29UnknownThen you get Solomon Sultry, Jack Hawkins, Othello where his wife he kills his wife. And yeah I mean that's I mean again that's one of the more ridiculous ones.

1:38:42UnknownYes. That really has gone to town I think. Because he's Well it's just how quickly that man switches from Yes. Yeah. And but also it's the the smothering. It's a fairly swift smothering.

1:39:01UnknownYeah it takes about 15 seconds to kill her. She puts up no fight. And love a heart she's not a a a wiry woman. She could put up a fight.

1:39:11UnknownYeah. And yeah she's she's dead instantly. And it takes him about 10 seconds to be convinced to murder her in front of another in front of all this. Yeah.

1:39:23UnknownThat's how jealousy is. But yeah so Diana Dors the British Marilyn Monroe she was known. And Jack Hawkins who is Solomon Sultry who had in 1966 he'd had throat he had cancer.

1:39:44UnknownOh yeah. And actually had his larynx removed. And then every subsequent appearance he made in films he's dubbed. And the dubber on this is Charles Gray who is well Charles Gray is MacArthur in Sorry Lee I was just saying that Jack Hawkins like Solomon Sultry the guy who smothers his missus.

1:40:09UnknownHe had throat cancer and had had his larynx removed in the 60s. And every subsequent role he did he was dubbed and in this he's dubbed by Charles Gray.

1:40:18UnknownSee now I did notice Charles Gray's name in the credits but I saw it at a flash and I remember thinking don't remember Charles Gray being in this yeah and then didn't see him.

1:40:27UnknownSo yeah no it makes perfect sense. Yeah. Apparently he did a lot of like overdubbing for Jack Hawkins. Yeah his voice would suit his face. Yeah. Then you've got Chloe Moon, Coral Brown you we've already talked about.

1:40:42UnknownShe did a show with Vincent Price though. I thought you might be interested Lee. called where is it?

1:40:52UnknownRubber baby there we go. Time Express in which her and her and Vincent Price played Jason and Margaret Winters who were the sophisticated hosts of the Time Express a train which took its passengers back in time to relive a momentous moment of their lives.

1:41:15UnknownRan for four episodes that did. Maybe not then. Yeah but I mean she's But there's I mean this again you know I mean that that is definitely because the le- on the le- commentary they do say about that's where they got you know in Psychoville where Maureen and David Sowerbutts are going around killing the people to cover up David's bad murder.

1:41:42UnknownYeah. And they basically do this on the they do this to the woman in that where it's basically they take her in and say oh yeah we're doing a a TV program about like it's like a makeover show.

1:41:57UnknownAnd then they just plug her in and kill her. So it's that it's the same same thing. And then of course you've got the mighty Meredith Merriwether, Robert Morley Tybalt Andronicus fed his own bed with them my babies you know they are my babies.

1:42:14UnknownBut I mean obviously and then you 've got and like I say you've got him you've got like Robert Morley who is just runs through bloody British TV and British film at the time and was always sort of feckless people or ineffectual sort of people.

1:42:33UnknownSo again you sort of you know where you are with him. Yeah. And one one thing I didn't realise he played Mike Croft Holmes in A Study in Terror.

1:42:44UnknownWhich is another Sherlock Holmes Jack the Ripper movie. Oh. And I just think yes I can see him as Mike Croft Holmes as well because it's that sort of I'd imagine I'd imagine he portray him very intelligently but also he'd get the fecklessness right.

1:42:59UnknownWhere Mike Croft is essentially meant to be lazy as arseholes and bored. And I can see Robert Morley doing that particularly well. Yeah.

1:43:12UnknownAnd then oh and then weirdly enough you've got

1:43:18UnknownMadeleine Smith playing the Devlin's secretary in this Rosemary. And quite a sort of reduced role for her. But Corblimey what a cracker. Yeah. Yes because vampire lovers you know well that will do for me.

1:43:39UnknownErotica in up Pompeii you know. But I mean yeah I think she was sort of like she it was like oh what and I can keep my clothes on.

1:43:47UnknownThank you because it's going to be fucking cold in 1973 London. She's also wearing the biggest pearl necklace I have ever seen in the film And that saying something.

1:44:01UnknownThat is a classic laugh. That is going to be my text tone when I

1:44:08Unknownyeah she's wearing a necklace of pearls that get bigger and bigger until they reach the front and the one at the front is literally a ping pong ball size size pearl.

1:44:18UnknownBut yeah it didn't make sense. Is she featured in another movie where like Lionheart's press secretary really hates the press secretaries of all the He's definitely bumping her off by just increasing the weight of her It snaps her neck.

1:44:35UnknownBut that wouldn't work though because then you could take them off and she's just got this huge great big muscle of a neck. Yeah like a neck is wider than shoulders.

1:44:46UnknownFan off. Yeah yeah she ends up with one of the Why do your ears go straight down to your shoulders? What's going on there mate? But Vincent Price said this was his favorite film of any that he did.

1:45:01UnknownI think it shows how could you not have fun Yeah. playing Lionheart. That's just you get to do all your serious look at me I'm a really good actor.

1:45:10UnknownPlus all your sort of campy The comedy yeah. You know you get to do a bit of everything in there. That's very true. Because he and I suppose I mean something like fives there has to be the restriction of oh yeah I had to loop all me dialogue and then they played it in afterwards.

1:45:26UnknownYeah. Whereas with this he gets to per- he fully performs. Yeah. And like you say he does he gets to go oh I I understand and I can do overacting.

1:45:36UnknownYeah. And then it's like and then like the end where they do King Lear at the end as well and it's like It's he's proper fucking up Ophelia. Yeah.

1:45:45UnknownEspecially especially when Edwina dies. Yeah. And he's just like he goes King Kong and just like Yeah yeah. Apparently this is Diana Rigg's favorite film of hers as well.

1:46:01UnknownAnd yeah I think again I'd be tempted to say masterpiece. I don't think you're far off there sir. I agree I agree this is this is one of the funniest films that I think came out of the whole of the 70s.

1:46:17UnknownI think a lot of the a horror in all genres really in the 70s took itself very seriously. And I think Vincent Price was one of those actors who wasn't and really was enjoying himself.

1:46:32UnknownYeah and his films of this decade particularly stand out for that reason because he it is it's that early black comedy. Yeah where everyone was having a great time and it was ludicrous and he was poking fun at a lot of stuff.

1:46:51UnknownNobody was taking it overly seriously. But as you were saying Claire you know there's there's a surprising amount of gore in it. Yeah. Yeah and it's just got everything to the right There is a strong story throughout.

1:47:03UnknownYeah. And we were saying that it's so nice and refreshing to see a film just end. But the story's been told it's finished now. There's no sort of big wrapping up Yeah there's no sort of like what happened to everyone after this and it's like you know why because no one gives a fuck.

1:47:22UnknownLionheart's dead. You know that's that's it is done its job. We'll film the building burn to its ground. Yeah. But I think I think also it's it's got enough of everything like you say because it's re- it is gore.

1:47:38UnknownYou know there are some nasty fucking deaths in it. So from that point of view you you sort of you gore hound or you sadist is going to be quite satisfied with it.

1:47:48UnknownI'm actually satisfied by the fact that there is a lot of gritty London which I think I mean especially like Michael Horden death that's like the extremist episode of the Sweeney that you will ever watch.

1:48:02UnknownIt's like like you said Lee it being on location just made it look so good really added Yeah. You know. Yeah. And it's like a it's good snapshot of London at the time because you've got stuff like you you are talking about like there's Devlin's flat.

1:48:19UnknownAnd then and then just yeah just below it you've got like the wrecked docks and you've got I mean that bit the bit where they've got the like like Edwina meets Devlin by that sort of hump of that bridge tunnel.

1:48:36UnknownYeah. I mean that could be you know that could be like 1800s until a car appears. You know and it's That's why the Meth Drinkers sort of in their Victorian in their crumpled top hat doesn't look out of place.

1:48:51UnknownIt's only when you think about it. Yeah because they would be out they would be out of place if they were in Devlin's flat. Because at that point it's like that's costuming.

1:48:59UnknownYeah. Yeah because it's it's kind of you know you can see that they're not what we've got now. They're not the full-on skyscrapers but there are big glass modern buildings outside.

1:49:11UnknownHe's still on London Bridge and as you say the the old stuff of the dock is old London dock when it was a horrible filthy old dock that hadn't been used for 60 70 years at this point.

1:49:23UnknownYeah and it is it's a real time capsule of a movie where it shows that where we went from what we'd had from Victorian era they'd just been kind of left derelict before it suddenly all became Canary Wharf.

1:49:37UnknownAnd it was big glass skyscrapers with big lasers on top and all the you know the shit that we've got now. Yeah and it's a perfect encapsulation of that that period in between.

1:49:48UnknownYeah there's just it's gorgeous to shoot in and just looks fantastic. I'm going to give you some further viewing. I know this is like a weird one but it just came up while I was because there's so many crossovers of people in this being in other films together.

1:50:05UnknownSo I'm going to say I said about Kleinholtz and Coronets just because of Dennis Price's presence and a few of the other actors in it but mainly that is just a really good film to watch.

1:50:13UnknownThe bed sitting room despite Milligan film you've got quite a few people in there you got Arthur Lowe and Michael Horden and they that's just a great apocalypse comedy.

1:50:28UnknownThen you've got the plank the Eric Sykes like a sort of silent classic. Well my my dad who did have a bit of a don't know what it was but he just he just didn't like Eric Sykes.

1:50:42UnknownI don't know what had happened but he didn't like Eric Sykes so he'd always like the plank Eric Sykes. He fucking is.

1:50:50UnknownWe should shake it down for your pocket money. What happened? But also there's a film called The Ruling Class and a lot of the people in this like yeah and that is a film with Peter O'Toole and it's again a very blackly comic film.

1:51:08UnknownAnd the guy who plays Trevor Howard is his father in it who dies. And basically what happens is is it's the what are they the Earl of Gurney. And the old Earl dies in a sex accident so Trevor Howard there acting type apparently.

1:51:27UnknownAnd then they like bring the they going to bring the new Lord in but the new Lord has been in a mental asylum since he was a child because he's delusional and believes he's Jesus Christ.

1:51:39UnknownSo they bring him into the world of the like the being the Lord of the manor. But no one no one else in the family and no one connected to him can understand him because he because he's pro- because in his head he's Christ.

1:51:54UnknownHe wants to be nice to people and he wants to help people and it's basically the whole point of it being the ruling class is they like what the fuck is wrong with him?

1:52:03UnknownOf course he's insane. He's giving away his money. He's doing it. And but then but when it takes a really bleak turn is that they get a psychiatrist in to fix him.

1:52:14UnknownAnd the psychiatrist fixes him. But unbeknownst to any of them he now believes he's Jack the Ripper. But although he believes he's Jack the Ripper everyone else thinks he's cured because they consider his wor- he now feels like a member of the aristocracy because he's basically this horrible brutal to precious murdering fuck.

1:52:38UnknownFits fits right in. Yeah

1:52:40Unknownand looking up. It's it's it's seriously it's really good. You've got like I say Trevor Dickman's in it. Arthur Lowe plays the butler who is fucking incredible. because he basically because the Earl is nice to him he's like oh just have a drink you know and so he's just wandering around pissed and there's just a bit where he throws he brings him he's been he's in the old Lord's will as well so he's going to come into a lot of money.

1:53:05UnknownAnd he just comes in at one point with a tray of like just throws it on the floor. Tears served and then Yeah it's it's a really great film so I definitely would recommend after this is The Ruling Class because and Coral Brown's in it as one of the like relatives and stuff like that and yeah you you'll spot loads of people in it.

1:53:28UnknownLike one of the Meth Drinkers is in there and stuff so yeah. And I highly recommend.

1:53:36UnknownThat sounds fantastic. right so I think we should probably wrap it up. I think we've been whittling on for a very long time this evening. Sorry yes. Sorry team.

1:53:48UnknownIt's good well that's a lovely thing is to have Claire on after she's been mentioned so often and feels like part of the team although yeah it's She's not pulling her wings.

1:54:02UnknownThat's not it at all. You are the originator of Ask Welcome to Horror. Yeah. And and by the same extension you're the originator of hashtag ask not for

1:54:16UnknownYou're welcome boys. So what what could we watch to get Claire back again? Yeah tell us What would be the next step? Well it's funny because I said to you didn't I that I've not that Hitchcock feels like a gap today.

1:54:31UnknownBecause I've watched like horror icons and I've not really watched anything modern and I mean like the last 10 years modern. And so I've not seen anything like that.

1:54:43UnknownAnd maybe an introduction to ghosts but so it's not too shit your pants. But something I'd quite like to dip my toe in. And because sort of ghosts and zombies are still my things that I'm like I don't I don't like.

1:55:03UnknownOne day. So we've got ghosts zombies Hitchcock. Hitchcock Yeah. And something modern. And something modern.

1:55:22UnknownIs is this like the weirdest wedding list Yeah.

1:55:27UnknownWell don't go for something modern next. Would you be willing to join us again next week Claire? Yeah. Okay maybe we should go for something modern then because we've not done anything modern for a while now I don't feel.

1:55:44UnknownAnd

1:55:49Unknowngoing to have to read in some of this because I need to think something modern.

1:55:54UnknownLeave it as a surprise. Yeah. Yes let's do that. So I'm stuck in the beer. Trying to think of something modern to watch. Oh Mandy. Mandy Mandy. Yeah that's not a bad suggestion.

1:56:10UnknownOkay yeah. So let's do that next. So let's do Mandy next week. Okay. Yeah.

1:56:20UnknownBut I have seen your pants.

1:56:25UnknownOh right yeah. I thought you meant just now. It's very hot in here. I'm concerned by that. Yeah excellent right so we'll we'll do put it away.

1:56:39UnknownSo that was 2018. So that is pretty new. Excellent right so we'll do Mandy next week if you you are happy to join us again Claire. Yeah that'd be lovely.

1:56:50UnknownFantastic right. So thanks ever so much for listening. If you haven't already then go and watch Theatre of Blood because we all highly recommend it. And if you've got to this far in the podcast we've ruined it.

1:57:04UnknownLike you say it's 50 years old. Yeah. Diana Rigg in a moustache still sexy.

1:57:12UnknownSo go and watch Mandy and we'll see you all next week. Don't forget to send in your hashtag ask welcome to horror questions although you never do. But it's all right we don't take it personally.

1:57:23UnknownYeah we we we just do it internally now. Yeah. We've got our own personal team of insiders who do it for us so it's excellent. yeah and we'll see you next week for Mandy.

1:57:35UnknownThanks very much. Goodnight. Goodnight. Bye.